For the time being, given our national emergency, we are switching to DAILY COVID-19 threads instead of weekly threads. Your comments and updates are most welcome. PLEASE continue to include your valuable information, hard source links, and local observations on these COVID Daily Threads. Additionally, within these Daily Threads, we will try to include links to government and official pressers, so those who no longer have cable can remain informed.
We’ll get through this crisis, together. As a group, there is probably no one better prepared than we are.
For our newcomers: The Q Tree community has been diligent in covering the threat of Coronavirus, COVID19, Wuhan FLU. We started accumulating information about this virus in mid-late January, in what became almost weekly threads. We’ve been weeks, if not months, ahead of MSM outlets to vet rumors and other medical papers, etc.
Primary Update Links:
- Links to the USA CoronaVirus Task Force: http://coronavirus.gov/
- Johns Hopkins CSSE Dashboard to update number of “official” cases within China and worldwide: https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6
- Another summary of data, updates and sources: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
- Hard Link to the World Health Organization: https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019
- Hard Link to the Center for Disease Control: CDC Updates: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/index.html
In our past weekly threads, we assembled information on the following:
- Primary update links. The dashboard from Johns Hopkins which counts “official” cases all over the world, the CDC, and WHO, and includes the links for our past threads.
- Hard Data Medical Information- Explanation about testing, reliance on China for drugs, analysis of NE Journal of Medicine results and other published papers.
- Vaccine and theraputics (new/old drugs to alleviate symptoms) news and updates
- Trump Administration response (the timeline and links to various agencies)
- China Responses, timelines, research, attempt to cover actions, or secrecy in results discovered.
- An aggregate of info/responses from other countries, listed by country.
- Economic impact from around the world. A change in economic activity will indicate a “return to normal”.
- Speculation/debunking on how the virus started
- Media Bias, political response, and debunking section, like the article from AP News, overt bias from Politico, inflammatory headlines, etc.
- Other medical info to boost immune system, herbal remedies, ways to keep your house clean and NOT spread the virus to others. Excellent information to incorporate into daily lifestyle.
- Hard links for OTHER valuable sources/blogs and a brief sentence or two about what they provide
- Other news items
Our weekly updates. timelines, collection of valuable information, can be found here:
- January 25th, Our first thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/01/25/20200125-coronavirus/
- January 27th, Our second thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/01/27/20200127-coronavirus-update-thread/
- February 1st-9th, Our third thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/02/01/20200201-coronavirus-update-thread-3/
- February 10th – 18th, Our Fourth Thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/02/10/20200210th-19th-coronavirus-thread/
- February 19-29th: Our Fifth Thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/02/18/20200218th-29th-coronavirus-update-thread/
- March 1-10th, Our Sixth Thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/03/01/2020-march1st-7th-coronavirus-covid19-xivirus-wuflu-6th-update-thread/
- March 9-16th, Our Seventh Thread: https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/03/09/2020-march-9th-16th-coronavirus-covid19-xivirus-wuflu-7th-weekly-update-thread/
Please try to keep your sense of humor during this National Emergency, and remember, patience is a virtue.
Love to all!
Ok, just because Daughn said we need some humor, and I’m feeling upbeat about the anti-malarial drugs working & available soon …
https://twitter.com/squill_whispers/status/1241216406173204480?s=21
Good advice.
🤣😂
On a more serious, yet upbeat note
WOWWWWW, that is great news.
Yeah, I haven’t heard a damn thing about a malaria outbreak. Looks like we might have something effective here. It would be wonderful!
No malaria – yet – but every time the temps go up we see mosquitoes. We didn’t have a long enough cold snap to deal with them.
Who knows. This might be the summer of the bug zapper.
I believe that this is one of the ChiCom disinformation bots. Very effective – Twitter algos and ChiCom techniques boost her high up to the top of Karli’s feed.
Here’s the actual context – what she is replying to.
https://twitter.com/KarluskaP/status/1241150099134328833
Don’t engage unless you’re skilled at taking out / taking down ChiBots. They are here to get us BANNED.
Thanks for the warning, Wolf. I almost replied to that person, but something just didn’t seem right. Now I know why.
Notice their lovey-dovey stuff. Totally designed to avoid being suspended.
The EVIL of ChiComs manifested in their patience to achieve an evil goal.
“he by a mistake”
“THY #DeepState”
** Grammatical and spelling errors.
** Can Indicate a person (bot) with wrong / incomplete knowledge of the English language.
And I capitalized “indicate” by mistake. Mea culpa.
Yup. And if you push back on it, I’m sure there are weapony excuses at the ready.
Does weapony have anything to do with dogfaced pony soldier? Asking for a friend.
I’ll do my part – I won’t engage them on Twitter.
Hopefully you won’t engage them here, either. We’re under membership lockdown as well. Having to let some people slide who want in.
The quality of this site turns on these efforts. Anyone wanting a reminder need only pay a visit over there. That discussion is so easily distracted or derailed.
Maybe “pivots on these efforts” would have said it better…
Yup. Gotta keep the CHINA VIRUS out. All forms.
Muchly appreciate your strong vetting, Boss. ❤️❤️❤️
I an honored that I am allowed to comment here…thank you!
Getting in on the ground floor here was a good idea for everybody who did it!
Stairs are a bummer. Ground floor is good for all the old geezers. 🙂
wordpiss again.
Here’s a pertinent tweet I saw earlier:
Joe M
@StormIsUponUs
·
5h
Ok THAT’S IT! Deliberate disinfo traps pushing fakery onto the feeds to create a fog of war in these uncertain times. Worst I’ve seen. There’s coordination to it, and it’s working. Function is to drown out anything that’s real. Information warfare DEFCON 2.
All this China Virus testing is both a blessing and a curse. It’s good to know where we are, but it’s also a bit scary. We are now #5 in the world for number of cases. We just passed Iran and are about to pass Germany. If you follow the numbers on the Worldometers site, they are constantly updating. New York now has over 8500 cases. I’m trying to figure out why they would have so many, when it seemed to have started in Washington state. The Washington curve seems to be flattening at 1500.
Whoa! They just updated and New York now has 8900!
And we just passed Germany with over 20,000 cases.
We’re a big country, and we’re gonna have big numbers – like all of Europe combined.
Yes. The sheer size of our population is going to make a difference in the number of cases that appear here.
All of Europe would just about fit into New England land wise.
We have 330 million people. We’re going to have some of the largest numbers before this is done.
I’m watching the mortality rates. That’s the curve I want BENT DOWN TO NEAR ZERO.
At the end of the day, China will be #1. They will obscure all their numbers to prevent it.
India has over a billion people and only 258 cases. We were obviously a target.
Hopefully the heat of India will stop it dead in its tracks.
Coronavirus can’t coexist with malaria.
Or anti-malarials being taken as preventative by people in malaria-ridden regions.
I think the numbers will bear that out.
I think they started hitting contacts of targeted people (perhaps spies and the like – non-notables) in summer of 2019, because of the slowness to build to an epidemic. Then around shampeachment – which they decided to D R A G _ O U T for even more time, they began accelerating. Then after it was open season in January, they could go wilder with amateurs like the press spreaders.
China could easily have over 1 million deaths so far…and how would we know?
The ChiComs lie about everything.
Remember undercover conversation w/ Wuhan Funeral Director? She estimated that all 8 Funeral homes were cremating 1000 bodies/day. We need to see updated sulfur maps.
“….’m trying to figure out why they would have so many, when it seemed to have started in Washington state…..”
That is VERY EASY.
50+ DIRECT FLIGHTS from WUHAN CHINA to NYC by Chinese airlines alone.
~140 people per flight
+ 7000 per month MINIMUM (Remember American airlines also had flights)
First case IDed in Wuhan November 17 so became infected beginning of November.
President Trump shut down flights Feb 2. So that is around three months of flights.
3X7000 = 21,000 possible carriers flying into NYC.
As we saw with Biogen and Italy and S. Korea, all it takes is ONE super spreader, close contact and TIME.
….
Let’s look at just the Biogen case:
ASSUME ONE INFECTED PERSON on Feb. 26-27
A couple weeks later:
March 9, 2020 (Updated)
https://www.bostonherald.com/2020/03/09/biogens-boston-conference-continues-to-be-leading-source-of-coronavirus-cases/
“…About 175 Biogen managers coming from all over the world — “Yes, from Italy,” a company spokesman confirmed — gathered for a major meeting of the biotech giant held at the Boston Marriott Long Wharf hotel Feb. 26-27. Italy, at that time, was beginning to see the virus spread….”
“…The coronavirus toll linked to a Biogen management meeting in Boston has now jumped to 108 people infected in Massachusetts…”
And then the North Carolina cases:
March 9 (Seven cases)
Biogen employs more than 1,400 people in Research Triangle Park. The first 5 out of seven cases were Biogen employees.
Now North Carolina has 230 cases with 54 new cases. They are mostly centered around Research Triangle Park, Duke/UNC universities and the Charlotte area the ‘new tech hub’
March 21, 2020 at 12:43 a.m.
https://www.bostonherald.com/2020/03/04/coronavirus-in-massachusetts-by-the-numbers/
Massachusetts has 413 cases and one death.
413 (+85 from previous day) confirmed cases
1 dead from Winthrop (man in his 80s)
97 are associated with the Biogen conference [interesting they DECREASE the number]
63 are “local transmission”
49 are “travel related”
204 are “under investigation”
58 people have been hospitalized
144 cases in Middlesex County
86 cases in Suffolk County, including the first confirmed case (Feb. 1)
64 cases in Norfolk County
20 cases in Berkshire County
29 cases in Essex County
19 cases in Worcester County
11 in Plymouth County
9 in Barnstable County
20 in Berkshire County
6 in Bristol County
3 in Hampden County
2 in Hampshire County
1 in Franklin County
19 listed as “unknown”
195 are female; 218 are male
2,666 individuals, to date, who have been tested by state
940 by LabCorp
485 by Quest
41 by other labs
I don’t believe we’ve passed Iran, and I’m not even sure of those NYC numbers. There are anti-Americans who want to create the idea that the city is being overwhelmed… Remember there was going to be an increase in cases simply because of increased testing. NYC is the gateway on the east coast for international travel – and while we held off China, we didn’t hold off the rest of the world as soon as would have been helpful.
Because of Commie deBlasio, I don’t believe anything about NYC.
Interesting blast from the past…the early days of the Swine Flu Pandemic…even back then they were playing games on what to call the virus…in this case trying to down play how serious it was. I watched a bunch of videos on youtube related to Hussein Obama and Swine Flu. What a difference in media reaction…
I can remember any number of schools here, private, public, and parochial, closing for a few days when there was a significant percentage of the students out sick. It was done to get the kids well without missing much, scrub the entire school(s) down with Clorox, and just take a breather. If snow days haven’t been taken, may as well use them.
And it almost always happens in February and March. Gee, go figure.
Mexican “H1N1” Swine Flu as dry run?
The ChiComs weren’t ready for people to know about their pet virus yet, back in December:
A friend shared this link this morning. I watched it and feel like I got into the middle of someone’s on-going analysis. I did check the first name, which I think they believe is patient zero who still has a Linkedin account. Maatja Benassi. She was apparently in a military bike race in Wuhan last October, crashed, but finished the race. I don’t remember seeing the name before but they mentioned getting the name from some press conference. I have only been able to watch one or two. This does not tell me a lot more other than there are two more people with the same last name. They may have done courier work. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moT5qxeC6Fk
This has some information on the subject:
https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/03/20/20200320-dear-kmag-open-thread/comment-page-3/#comment-435089
This has some information on the subject:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moT5qxeC6Fk
Besides eating live bats and mice…. this….
https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1241293779694268417
China and Africa will continue producing dread diseases, pandemics, flu and coronaviruses until this kind of thing stops.
It will never stop! It’s centuries of cultural lifestyle….these people cannot read, have no access to outside comms, without any or very little schooling, have never been taught to think for themselves. For them, it’s survival…period.
Not China. Indonesia maybe.
After the press briefing when President Trump and the task force announced the informal, but monitored trial of Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19….
BLOOMBERG immediately came out with this on Chloroquine: (bold mine)
“(Bloomberg) — The drug touted by the U.S. President Donald Trump as a possible line of treatment against the coronavirus comes with severe warnings in China and can kill in dosages as little as two grams.
China, where the deadly pathogen first emerged in December, recommended the decades-old malaria drug chloroquine to treat infected patients in guidelines issued in February after seeing encouraging results in clinical trials. But within days, it cautioned doctors and health officials about the drug’s lethal side effects and rolled back its usage.”
[…]
“A woman in Wuhan proved how lethal chloroquine can be when it’s taken beyond the recommended dose. On Feb. 25, Shanghai-based The Paper reported that she took 1.8 grams of the drug she ordered online after suspecting she had the coronavirus. She did not, but the drug caused her to develop malignant cardiac arrhythmia, which can cause sudden death, and she was admitted to the intensive care unit.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/Health/healthtrending/virus-drug-touted-by-trump-musk-can-kill-in-just-two-grams/ar-BB11rIHa?ocid=st2
BLOOMBERG fails to mention that Chinese chloroquine – like other Chinese drugs and other products are known to be unreliable, toxic, dangerous – even deadly!
They make and sell a form of it for fish aquariums. If people are taking that it is highly toxic for humans. For malaria, I’ve seen dosage of 400mg once a week. For virus, I’m seeing 600mg/day X 6-10 days. Side effects are bad, it can cause permanent eye damage among other things.
Adjunct therapies of antioxidants, etc. can ameliorate toxicity – and sometimes the adjunct therapy can become a therapy. For example, they used antioxidants to offset toxicity of strong/harsh seizure medicines and patients with epilepsy and ataxia improved in their ataxia clinical picture….so they tried the adjunct therapy for their ataxia clinic patients and lo and behold all improved. It wasn’t a cure, but improved life for those patients.
MICHAEL BLOOMBERG is humiliated and angry that he couldn’t buy his way into the Oval Office.
So now he directs his news agency to perform this type of destructive work.
As I posted on the Q Tree previously (summary):
DO NOT BUY CHLOROQUINE OR HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE ONLINE.
DO NOT SELF-DIAGNOSE.
DO NOT TAKE THESE DRUGS WITHOUT A DOCTOR”S SUPERVISION.
The piece of truth in the Bloomberg item that Michael Bloomberg is blowing up into “Stop Chloroquine” is this:
Chloroquine and Hydroxychloroquine CAN CAUSE IRREGULAR HEARTBEAT, among other side effects.
This is why a DOCTOR has to EVALUATE and PRESCRIBE these drugs.
The doctor will balance using these drugs on a person who has CO-MORBIDITIES and/or if there is a chance of INTERACTION with other drugs that the person is taking.
Having said this:
I believe POTUS will need to keep pushing the FDA to approve the use of these drugs on a PRELIMINARY basis, whether under “Right to Try”, or with prior written consent from the patient to waive all claims in the event of worsening health condition and/or death.
Otherwise, the FDA will tie up the use of these drugs FOR MONTHS with “testing” and “human trials”.
And:
It may well be useful for anybody with health conditions and/or taking NOT ONLY prescription drugs, but ALSO supplements, vitamins, and herbals, to WRITE DOWN, 1st: a list of the health conditions they have; and, 2nd, a complete list of what they are taking, the dosage, and the frequency. Give a copy of this list to their doctor; keep a copy at home in a place where it can be easily found; and keep a folded copy in their wallet.
EXCELLENT ADVISE!
Sort of like a medical ID bracelet. You might want to keep a list right next to your drivers licence clearly labeled.
Yes! Bloomberg and China want to weaponize ANYTHING against Trump in the CHI-SYMP FAKE NEWS MEDIA.
Bloomberg is a very nasty guy – as Trump would say – which we learned as his campaign went on.
Thread here:
Italy shows us how PC kills:
https://twitter.com/chnrobi/status/1240842709507637248
PC KILLS!
To spread the coronavirus, Islamists are spitting on elderly in Europe and Antifa are doing the same in the USA.
A great Twitter Warrior, Philip Schuyler@FiveRights writes:
“MSNBC’s Maddow,
Your party wanted to continue flights from China.
Your network is now trying to create as much anxiety as poss.
In EU, your jihadist brethren are coughing & spitting on old ppl to try to spread virus.
In USA, Antifa types are doing same.
You must be so proud.”
*
Another @FiveRights tweet:
@CNN @MSNBC @ABC @NBC @CBS @PBS @nytimes @washingtonpost
Bc u like their politics u won’t condemn Antifa for atkg ppl.
Now members are trying to spread virus, which will result in deaths.
U could’ve demonized Antifa.
But u tacitly supported them.
Like them, u exist to do harm.
*
More here – Tommy Robinson protects elders being attacked by Islamists in UK:
wow….there just are no words fit to print for those vile depraved goat- fu###ers…
… and then there’s <3 Tommy Robinson…hero type.
VISUALIZING THE HISTORY OF PANDEMICS
3/20/20 article excellent graphics: https://www.visualcapitalist.com/history-of-pandemics-deadliest/
Thank you kindly for the Twitter versions!
I had the links last week, but not the tweets!
Interesting personal report from a scientist in the US with life long lung issues…
FLORIDA ….. 563 known cases …Miami/Ft Lauderdale/Palm B very intense…here in Naples: 25 known cases…Gov has issued curfews in all counties starting at 11 pm every night…spreading too fast here…I am now assuming everyone I see or encounter might have it and not know it yet.
links for Florida updates soon coming…just got back from morning cycling out in the Florida UV RAYS …town is pretty much like a ghost town…shelves all empty…
anybody have any extra Tylenol ?
=^-^=
if yr interested in Florida Covid updates, this source provides latest info…mostly focused on Orlando/northern Florida….it comes into my Inbox every day…several articles…
sharing…
link…
https://newsletters.tribpub.com/newsletter/orlando-sentinel/orlando-morning-report-03-21-2020/
Mar 21, 2020
Those beaches were probably covered with spreaders.
yep…also, here in SWFL, a LOT of traveling to/from Miami on a regular basis among local residents…and a LOT of retail ….shopping, malls, stores, EATING…a LOT of congregating in a LOT of crowded every day activities…
Today’s briefing expected at noon ET.
12:30 pm!
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1241388217267560449
Thanks GF!
BTW, GF stands for most beloved and treasured girlfriend!!! 😍🤗😘
I think this is the link to today’s briefing:
Excellent in depth analysis of the numbers and the whole situation.
Table of Contents
Total cases are the wrong metric
Time lapsing new cases gives us perspective
On a per-capita basis, we shouldn’t be panicking
COVID-19 is spreading
Watch the Bell Curve
A low probability of catching COVID-19
Common transmission modes
COVID-19 is likely to burn off in the summer
Children and Teens aren’t at risk
Strong, but unknown viral effect
What about asymptomatic spread?
93% of people who think they are positive aren’t
1% of cases will be severe
Declining fatality rate
So what should we do?
Start with basic hygiene
More data
Open schools
Open up public spaces
Support business and productivity
People fear what the government will do, not infection
Expand medical capacity
Don’t let them forget it and vote
Local governments and politicians are inflicting massive harm and disruption with little evidence to support their draconian edicts. Every local government is in a mimetic race to one-up each other in authoritarian city ordinances to show us who has more “abundance of caution”. Politicians are competing, not on more evidence or more COVID-19 cures but more caution. As unemployment rises and families feel unbearably burdened already, they feel pressure to “fix” the situation they created with even more radical and “creative” policy solutions. This only creates more problems and an even larger snowball effect. The first place to start is to stop killing the patient and focus on what works.
https://medium.com/six-four-six-nine/evidence-over-hysteria-covid-19-1b767def5894
Media is driving this whole nation into panic mode. One news station has even been reporting when people are getting tested, over a dozen they reported on,. With research one could figure out who, along with the fact it turned out there were no corona virus cases for even a couple of weeks after their reports of the testing. In other words the station was just needlessly panicking people.
H3LL the number of people just in America that died from the flu in just a month was/is way higher than the number of people who died from Coronavirus world wide In just one week more people just in America got/get the flu than all of the people worldwide have gotten the virus.
As I said below, I don’t think this is a coincidence. The left and left owned media is over demonizing Trump, regardless of what he does.
I thought this might be interesting –
Chloroquine is effective against influenza A virus in vitro but not in vivo
Abstract
Background Chloroquine is an inexpensive and widely available 9‐aminoquinolone used in the management of malaria. Recently, in vitro assays suggest that chloroquine may have utility in the treatment of several viral infections including influenza.
Objectives We sought to test whether chloroquine is effective against influenza in vivo in relevant animal models.
Methods The effectiveness of chloroquine at preventing or ameliorating influenza following viral challenge was assessed in established mouse and ferret disease models.
Results Although active against influenza viruses in vitro, chloroquine did not prevent the weight loss associated with influenza virus infection in mice after challenge with viruses expressing an H1 or H3 hemagglutinin protein. Similarly, clinical signs and viral replication in the nose of ferrets were not altered by treatment.
Conclusions Although in vitro results were promising, chloroquine was not effective as preventive therapy in vivo in standard mouse and ferret models of influenza virus infection. This dampens enthusiasm for the potential utility of the drug for humans with influenza.
*https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4941887/
Good to know. IMO, this means that chloroquine is strongly intervening in some cellular mechanism that is required for coronavirus replication, but is not essential for influenza replication, thus allowing the immune system to catch up and develop antibodies for coronavirus, but not influenza.
Note – Flu vaccine that builds immunity to type A are not effective for coronavirus, in fact, seem to make people more susceptible.
“Study of flu vaccine and its effect on incidence of viral respiratory illness.”
Vaccine. 2020 Jan 10;38(2):350-354. doi: 10.1016/j.vaccine.2019.10.005. Epub 2019 Oct 10.
Abstract
PURPOSE:
Receiving influenza vaccination may increase the risk of other respiratory viruses, a phenomenon known as virus interference. Test-negative study designs are often utilized to calculate influenza vaccine effectiveness. The virus interference phenomenon goes against the basic assumption of the test-negative vaccine effectiveness study that vaccination does not change the risk of infection with other respiratory illness, thus potentially biasing vaccine effectiveness results in the positive direction. This study aimed to investigate virus interference by comparing respiratory virus status among Department of Defense personnel based on their influenza vaccination status. Furthermore, individual respiratory viruses and their association with influenza vaccination were examined.
RESULTS:
We compared vaccination status of 2880 people with non-influenza respiratory viruses to 3240 people with pan-negative results. Comparing vaccinated to non-vaccinated patients, the adjusted odds ratio for non-flu viruses was 0.97 (95% confidence interval (CI): 0.86, 1.09; p = 0.60). Additionally, the vaccination status of 3349 cases of influenza were compared to three different control groups: all controls (N = 6120), non-influenza positive controls (N = 2880), and pan-negative controls (N = 3240). The adjusted ORs for the comparisons among the three control groups did not vary much (range: 0.46-0.51).
CONCLUSIONS:
Influenza vaccination and respiratory virus interference among Department of Defense personnel during the 2017-2018 influenza season.
Receipt of influenza vaccination was not associated with virus interference among our population. Examining virus interference by specific respiratory viruses showed mixed results. Vaccine derived virus interference was significantly associated with coronavirus and human metapneumovirus; however, significant protection with vaccination was associated not only with most influenza viruses, but also parainfluenza, RSV, and non-influenza virus coinfections.”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31607599
Yes, thank you!
Re ‘Conclusions’, I am listening to Prof. Olivier Schwartz from the Pasteur Institute in Paris who said the same thing just now (Monday, March 23) on RMC (French radio).
I haven’t heard anyone in the UK mention chloroquine yet. (sitting, waiting)
Per 700WLW news report, 12:30PM today:
The Army Corps of Engineers will begin to build field tent hospitals in New York to cope with the influx of patients that they were told will happen.
OK. I won’t laugh. I won’t laugh. Oh hell, I did laugh 🙂 “Ground report”.
Dual purpose “Ground report” of sorts. Video of some stocking levels in Carson city Walmart. And, unfortunately, damage. Albeit quite minor damage.
Last night 4.5 earthquake near this Walmart Carson City.
Truly believe this is not a coincidence
Re second tweet, what about the rest of the world?
I’ve been harping on this for some time now. One more harp. Can’t promise it will be the last. All vids are very short.
First the Wuhan Shake. A celebratory PSA from China ((posted by one of us here)) showing what they were doing to stop the spread. Take away every one got was don’t shake hands. How do we miss the fact that everyone is wearing a mask.
https://twitter.com/TheSpeaker2018/status/1233798724167487490?s=20
Next the World Health Organization’s take on wearing a mask. Basically says not recommended unless your sick or caring for a sick person. Other than that no. Most nations to include the USA are following this recommendation.
Next Most Asian countries are not making mask wearing mandatory but but but encourage wearing a mask in a culture where wearing a mask is already an accepted norm by up to 50% of society. Under China Virus season it is hard to find pictures of people in crowds not wearing a mask. It seems to run at appox 95 to 99% compliance to the cultural norm of wearing a mask without mandating mask wearing.
Will masks protect you from COVID-19? ‘Mask-rush’ in South Korea
My take on making any sort of face covering mandatory in spread areas / hot zones is it will control spread and make social distancing work at a more practical distance than the current 6ft rule and thus facilitate commerce.
This is what I said over a week ago>>>
Personally, I think the CDC’s new guidelines are an attempt to damage the economy and here’s why.
No where in CDC’s guide lines does it recommend wearing a mask to protect others. It does mention the 6 foot danger zone, but never recommends how that zone might be narrowed to a lesser distance to decrease spread.
Here’s what they say when you click the link to social distancing:
“The best way to prevent illness is to avoid being exposed to this virus.
The virus is thought to spread mainly from person-to-person.
Between people who are in close contact with one another (within about 6 feet).
Through respiratory droplets produced when an infected person coughs or sneezes.
These droplets can land in the mouths or noses of people who are nearby or possibly be inhaled into the lungs.”
CDC guide lines only talk about wearing a mask to protect oneself, not others. Wrong way to think if they want to minimize spread. All their minimize spread recommendations deal with canceling events, sending people home, not gathering. Right now they allow for up to 50 people gathering. No mention of masks. When the reported numbers go up as we know they will, numbers that well could be exaggerated, will they next lower the number to say 10 and recommend stores and business’s to be closed next? ((Yeah that happened)).
Why not recommend a mask, or any face covering to protect others when the mask has the potential to narrow the 6 foot zone to a safe 2 feet or closer as long as it is blocking the major respiratory droplets from spreading into the air. You can watch any video in any hot zone and see masks are mandatory. Yet we can see many of the people are wearing cheap masks that would not be considered safe from letting the virus in. So why are masks mandatory. Simple answer is it protects others.
Another thing the CDC does not mention is building up and maintaining a healthy constitution through a balanced diet or vitamin regimen. Not a whiff of it. Why not?
Personally I’m looking at the CDC right now as wanting the virus to enjoy its life while its around why they appear to be doing the right thing, economics be damned and you can well guess the reason.
If we wish to stop the spread, make wearing any kind of mask mandatory in effected zones. A Good mask, a not so good mask, even a kerchief. Any of those will cut the 6 foot zone down to 3 to 1 foot.
The idea is not to protect yourself but protect others. Hello CDC?
The CDC is giving bogus guidance. Tell me where on their site they recommend cutting the effected zone down from 6 feet to as little as 1 foot by simply making the wearing of a mask mandatory in effected zones or zones that need protecting like the work place or where commerce takes place. They don’t want to stop the spread. They want the virus to continue to circulate, for older generations to be segregated from society and for commerce to be minimized. Is wearing a mask mandatory in high spread nations like China? It doesn’t matter the quality of the mask. It could be a simple kerchief and it would narrow the spread dramatically and facilitate commerce. End.
We are crashing an economy over not adopting a simple social norm that can be applied temporarily in hot zones.
Absent govt mandate or encouragement your stores should mandate the wear of any sort of face cover before being allowed access into that store so as to slow and disperse quicker the transmission of air borne particles that might be present and added benefit it helps prevent you from touching your face until you can wash your hands.
Shutting down most of economy is not the answer as everyone is still being funneled into grocery stores.
I could go on and on about this but will end for now saying Dr Fauci is either evil or wants/needs to have masks funneled into the health care system where there is an acute shortage of masks. I tend toward evil as less costly and effective face coverings can be used to slow the spread such as a simple bandanna across the mouth. It will stop the larger emissions of a CV carrier and it will permit for what does escape into the atmosphere to dissipate much quicker those facilitating commerce safely
I think it’s mask conservation for health care professionals. Nobody wants to admit that they were all made in China and we were caught flat-footed by that.
That would be like, you know, admitting Trump was right all along. Can’t have that. SIX FEET.
Remember Larry Ledwick (May God bless him)
Gave us the instruction on making homemade masks.
If you use cotton like the flour sack towels or cotton tees or a combo (three layers) you can toss them in the washer in hot water with soap and bleach.
Heck the flour sack towels I bought folded and tied at the back of your neck would work in a pinch.
Acknowledged in my post. Last paragraph. Meanwhile I advocate for a simpler face covering that will greatly enhance our social distancing rule and facilitate commerce yet we won’t adopt a simple norm that can slow transmission and keep commerce alive.
Also given the extreme narrowing of commerce, by essentially limiting it to grocery stores this could be easily applied. “You want to shop, wear a face cover”.
This may actually be one of the “possible messages at the end of 15 days”. that they currently have on deck, depending on outcome.
We may need MIXED MESSAGES for MIXED OUTCOMES. Why? Because let’s say that the COASTS are hit hard, and need to maintain a big quarantine, but FLYOVER is not. THEN we could ramp up production in flyover by easing distances and wearing protection, while still minimizing distance travel between heavily quarantined areas and elsewhere.
This is like Russia in WWII. the EAST is where they were able to produce the things needed to fight the Nazis in the West. Here, we can use Flyover to fight the CHINAZIS in New York, Washington State, and California.
I was thinking that too. Right now much can be gained by playing their silly game because the coasts are getting clobbered and with them the dem apparatus. We start to loose however when the government is allowed to take over much of private industry through bail outs tied to controlling shares in companies. Just one way. We’ve been posting others. We run the risk of over night socialism and some are putting a date on it by saying we can’t go beyond the end of May. Levin did an excellent piece on it with his Friday radio show as he echoed some others.
One more on the mask thing. Proof of sort without hunting down vids on the net if you can visualize what I say.
I vape. When I vape I create a rather large cloud of steam that pretty much exhibits the six foot social distancing space without exhaling and blowing the vape forcefully. Consider vaping to simply coloring in what normally is invisible. I can easily pass that six foot distance by forcefully blowing similar to how you might exhale when taking a seat or speaking excitedly. With a slight draft the vape can easily stay compacted and drift over ten feet before dissipating.
However if I exhale into my shirt you will barely see a wisp become visible and a harder to see is a fog of vapor a few inches about me. That would be the effect of a simple bandanna like a cowboy would wear.
Vape vapor would make a great video for the feds if they decide to promote masking as a solution to mix into the fix.
I will tell you right now – the LIBTARDS everywhere are going STIR CRAZY. They are DYING to get back to normal. They WANT to do the social distancing and hole up stuff because they want to OBEY the government, yet they are DYING to get somewhat back to normal. MASKING plus lesser social distance will sell easy on day 15. Let our VSG use that as he may.
https://twitter.com/karluskap/status/1241459182412484608?s=21
Excellent!
So a T shirt blocks 70% on the poor end and surgical mask does 89% on the better end.
Currently WHO and CDC are saying use nothing, just follow the 6ft rule. They must want us to catch this thing we can be chopping that 6 foot rule down by at least 4ft and still conduct commerce safely.
I think we are making progress.
Para – you put into words what many of us have been wondering. I understand prioritizing masks for medical personnel, but there will be NO excuse for not urging all citizens to wear masks during future flu seasons AND manufacturing enough that ALL households have a supply.
So if elective (choice) procedures are not being done to “conserve supplies” why is this even a question??
Well THAT’S gonna ruffle some panties in #NeverTrump and #Resistoids!
Yeah especially since he was one of their latest hero’s that would get rid of Orange Man. Karma Baby!!
Ugh… ugh…. MUSTACHE MAN…. ugh….. ugh….. BADGOOD…. ugh….. GOODBAD…..
Now that it’s come up again, notice no more calls to see what was in his book or attempts to interview him on it. It seems like the old “don’t ask if you don’t want to know the answer” thing. The media is suddenly practicing social distancing.
Information distancing! Very useful with ChiCom tricksters!
This crisis communications session is painful. The children keep trying to go for “GOTCHA” homeruns, and the president is swatting them.
FAKE NEWS, MADE IN CHINA, CAN’T STUMP THE TRUMP.
Kelly O’Donnell and her tone.
It’s that angry librarian tone. Scolding, disappointed, angry, out-of-sorts, and bitchy.
Fingerpointing at the President….
“We just want to make sure what is being promised to the people is being delivered”
But another added layer implying the WH is not doing everything they can.
“We just want to make sure what is being promised to the people is being delivered”
Someone who tweets should ask her about THESE PROMISES to the People:
you can keep your Doctor
you can keep your plan
It will cost less
(“In an Obama administration, we’ll lower premiums by up to $2,500 for a typical family per year.”)
Ten Broken Obamacare Promises
2,000 more ventilators
Truly astonishing that the media has no knowledge of medicine, definitions, terminology.
I mean, I’m the accountant, don’t know dirt about medicine, but wow – have we trained up quickly in the past two months. Media needs to do their homework.
http://www.msn.com/
Credit to the AP
13 hours ago
“Few homeless off California’s streets as virus spreads”
So while Gov. NEWSOM has ordered the rest of WE, THE PEOPLE, into sheltering in place at home throughout California — the 150,000 homeless in the state (60,000 in Los Angeles County alone) are not only still out on the streets; but there appears to be some resistance to their going to stay in the hotel rooms, RV trailers, and other accommodations, that the state is negotiating to have ready.
And by the way, it is interesting to read about how slow the DemCom-controlled state is in getting these living arrangements up and running quickly.
Letting them out of prisons seems extreme too when he’s calling for everyone to be quarantined. Aren’t jails their place of quarantine?
Shortages of masks in hospitals across the country (more precisely New York and California), are predominantly because the supplies are being stolen and hoarded by some.
That the same cities won’t arrest these people compounds the problem.
It’s like toilet paper.
I wonder what the black market price for masks are? (20 X)
https://www.insidehook.com/article/news-opinion/the-internet-is-now-a-black-market-for-coronavirus-face-masks
Per 700WLW, Cincinnati, 3PM Eastern news conference:
Well —
For the FIRST TIME, today, Dr. Amy Acton (previously Dr. Amy Beach(, the OHIO state public health department director, admitted that OHIO was “SEEDED” (her word) with the Wuhan Coronavirus through the NUMEROUS CHINESE who came and went all over the state — due to the “SISTER CITY” status of Wuhan AND of Hubei Province with COLUMBUS and other areas of Ohio.
Think about this. Wikipedia lists the HUGE NUMBER OF PLACES throughout the world that has “Sister City” agreements and programs with Wuhan and Hubei Province.
It would then be reasonable to think that MANY, if not ALL, of these places have been ALSO “seeded” with the Wuhan Coronavirus.
My opinion: This is ANOTHER REASON why Beijing DELIBERATELY refused to report the true nature of the virus within Communist China; punished Chinese doctors who tried to get the word out LAST DECEMBER; deliberately under-reported or obfuscated the true details and numbers about the infected and dead in Wuhan and Hubei Province.
Beijing was USING their people, in going back and forth among these “Sister City” areas, to SEED THE VIRUS.
It is inconceivable to me that Chairman (Dictator for Life) XI did not know this.
God Help Us
NASTY female reporter pushing Gov. DEWINE on the closing of abortion facilities in OHIO in order to preserve medical equipment and items for use in hospitals for people infected with the virus. Reporter trying for a “GOTCHA” on the “women not getting needed health services” meme.
Gov. DEWINE: Refer this to the Ohio court system.
SO FAR – in FL – of 658 positive confirmed cases – 159 are hospitalized and 12 deaths.
Total tested 7,237
Positive 658
Negative 6,579
Awaiting BPHL testing 1,002
More here:
https://floridadisaster.org/globalassets/covid19/dailies/covid-19-data—daily-report-2020-03-21-1008.pdf
Typo – 139 are hospitalized.
Is it so wrong to look at stats.
Twice as many people just in America have died from and are still dying from the flu than from the virus worldwide.
H3LL over 100 times more people just in America were confirmed as having the flu than number of people confirmed as having the Coronoavirus worldwide.
What the H3LL is going on with the world
FYI–there is now a pill they can use.
“CDC estimates that so far this season there have been at least 38 million flu illnesses, 390,000 hospitalizations and 23,000 deaths from flu.” https://www.cdc.gov/flu/weekly/index.htm
” The coronavirus pandemic has sickened more than 292,500 people, according to official counts. As of Saturday afternoon, at least 12,784 people have died,” https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/coronavirus-maps.html
If you had any doubt that people are tuning in to these press conferences, this will remove all doubt. I’ve just clipped a few parts of the article – you REALLY have to go read the whole thing, and look who is tweeting the same propaganda.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/03/20/calls-increase-for-msm-to-stop-airing-trump-live-you-will-get-people-killed/
“Calls are increasing for cable networks to stop airing President Donald Trump’s press conferences live as critics believe Trump is turning White House news briefings into virtual campaign rallies that can “get people killed” with lies about the Coronavirus crisis. The pressure only increased after Trump’s Friday
“At a moment of true national cataclysm, allowing him to use the bully pulpit in such an irresponsible manner is a risk we can’t afford to take,” Cohen continues. “His words raise the risk that Americans — particularly those who support the president — will ignore public health information that could potentially save lives.”
Others have suggested that the media just “record” any presser Trump attends and then “tell people what is true and what is false.”
Dirty rotten commie …
Paper from 2007
following some bread crumbs you started…
I’m not sure I’m truly comfy with this guy, but def. someone to watch…
https://wearethene.ws/notable/91145
The opportunity to take back the commons for the benefit of humanity as a whole is open – here and now.”
Post 8504989 1 hour ago • View on 8kun
Everyone should know who Robert David Steele is.
So I will share because he is probably a player to all your precious celbritards fate. This is a dig and before the influx of new people we used to DIG. TO REVEAL THE HIDDEN.
“In 1992, despite opposition from the CIA, he obtained Marine Corps permission to organise a landmark international conference on open source intelligence – the paradigm of deriving information to support policy decisions not through secret activities, but from open public sources available to all. The conference was such a success it brought in over 620 attendees from the intelligence world.”
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2014/jun/19/open-source-revolution-conquer-one-percent-cia-spy
“Steele is hugely respected by senior military intelligence experts across the world. As a researcher at the US Army War College’s Strategic Studies Institute, he has authored several monographs advocating the need for open source methods to transform the craft of intelligence. He has lectured to the US State Department and Department of Homeland Security as well as National Security Councils in various countries, ”
“Revolution is overthrow – the complete reversal of the status quo ante. We are at the end of centuries of what Lionel Tiger calls ‘The Manufacture of Evil,’ in which merchant banks led by the City of London have conspired with captive governments to concentrate wealth and commoditise everything including humans. What revolution means in practical terms is that balance has been lost and the status quo ante is unsustainable. There are two ‘stops’ on greed to the nth degree: the first is the carrying capacity of Earth, and the second is human sensibility. We are now at a point where both stops are activating.”
So why isn’t it happening yet?
“Preconditions are not the same as precipitants. We are waiting for our Tunisian fruit seller. The public will endure great repression, especially when most media outlets and schools are actively aiding the repressive meme of ‘you are helpless, this is the order of things.’ When we have a scandal so powerful that it cannot be ignored by the average Briton or American, we will have a revolution that overturns the corrupt political systems in both countries, and perhaps puts many banks out of business. Vaclav Havel calls this ‘The Power of the Powerless.’ One spark, one massive fire.”
Open Source Solutions Network Inc.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/futurism.com/18922-2/amp
https://russiancouncil.ru/en/robert-david-steele/
“I’m a former spy and I believe we still need spies and secrecy, but we need to redirect the vast majority of the funds now spent on secrecy toward savings and narrowly focused endeavors at home. For instance, utterly ruthless counterintelligence against corruption, or horrendous evils like paedophilia.”
Today he is the foremost proponent for Open Source Everything Engineering (OSEE), which is organized into nine major domains and twenty-seven sub-domains, all of which enable the creation of a post-Western economy without waste at roughly 10-20 percent the cost of the failed Western model that is 90% profit for the banks.
In 2017 he was recommended for the Nobel Peace Prize that he has said he does not deserve – but President Putin, President Trump, and General Secretary Xi would deserve this prize – apart from their efforts to denuclearize the Koreas and the Middle East – if they established an Open Source Agency for each continent to lift up the six billion poor
http://www.phibetaiota.net/2014/05/robert-steele-at-libtechnyc-the-open-source-everything-manifesto/
““Open Source Everything overturns top-down ‘because I say so at the point of a gun’ power. Open Source Everything makes truth rather than violence the currency of power. ”
“The national security state works for the City of London and Wall Street – both are about to be toppled by a combination of Eastern alternative banking and alternative international development capabilities, and individuals who recognise that they have the power to pull their money out of the banks and not buy the consumer goods that subsidise corruption and the concentration of wealth. The opportunity to take back the commons for the benefit of humanity as a whole is open – here and now.”
Why Everyone should mask up in hot zones hot zones hot zones only. Doesn’t work if everyone in a hot zone does not participate.
Everyone does this. Just not by vaping so it’s invisible to you. Guys breathe harder then Girls. These photos don’t get close to what some people do. Just saying.
The virus is said to be very light, micron size and floats with in a 6ft range before dissipating enough so as not to be a concern. Depending on how someone breaths that 6ft can easily be 10 ft especially with ever so slight drafts.
Now I’m not going to make a vid of me breathing down my shirt. But trust me when I say that you will hardly see a thing and the danger zone falls to 1 foot easily, except don’t walk too closely behind or there might be some slight fog effect but again nothing compared to these pictures.
Again something as simple as bandanna would go far in stopping the spread. Since were all being funneled into stores to shop for groceries making it mandatory to wear any kind of mask even a cheap piece of cloth over your face to get into the store would work better than no mask, especially since to conduct commerce your going to break the 6ft rule more often than not.
The last gig we did (birthday party) had a popcorn machine. We were outside. I could SMELL the butter from THIRTY FEET AWAY (nose is good at detecting down to 3-5 ppm)
6 feet is for droplets aka coughs. but that is not how viruses spread.
“…Significance
Lack of human data on influenza virus aerosol shedding fuels debate over the importance of airborne transmission. We provide overwhelming evidence that humans generate infectious aerosols</b. and quantitative data to improve mathematical models of transmission and public health interventions. We show that sneezing is rare and not important for—and that coughing is not required for—influenza virus aerosolization. “
* https://www.pnas.org/content/115/5/1081
Another study showed 6 feet is the MINIMUM but only because they did not look at further distances.
Whoops had a duplicate in there. Fixes.
Another odd note. Men are said to be catching CV more than woman in Eourpean studies. Why? 1. Perhaps they are more apt to invade someone’s space. 2. Are apt to be more taller and catch the vapors as they drift up? Both ways might mean a larger accumulation of virus.
I read that males have more ACE-2 receptors to which the CV attaches.
Males are also more likely to smoke.
Read that too. How do we know except the larger lung capacity so I’m sure it’s true from that stand point. Meanwhile I’m keeping it simple.
Ground report: Supply chains to grocery stores appear to be seriously messed up
shelves are Bare
VERY low at the beginning of the day in Multiple Middle TN locations – rural small towns, larger towns and Nashville.
Krogers, Publix, Costco
All had long lines. All were Very low stock to begin with and food going fast
Saw hardly any carts piled high with stuff – mainly just normal shopping cart amounts
many people in lines early in need of normal amounts of stuff – one lady out of dog food.
Kroger (small town and Bigger town) LOW – MANY empty shelves first thing this morning. still fresh veggies. Ice cream cleaned out – even the Hagan Das – unusual for the small, rural grocery. NO eggs in either.
Why no eggs? People can only stock up on so many eggs as most people do not know how to freeze or dry them.
Eggs – should be a stateside deliver and on normal routine. Why the interruption? Why Zero eggs anywhere first thing in the morning? If the only problem is over consumption then why is replenishing such an issue for a stateside product?
Costco (Brentwood/Nash) opened early because they had a line for about 300 yards, through the parking lot and to the street. Police had a presence to ensure people stayed off of the streets and security was present as well. I don’t remember noticing the presence of security guards visible at the entrances before – esp. not multiple.
We arrived 1 hr before time they were supposed to open, expecting to get ahead of the crowd and wait in line of the 10 am opening. Store already as full as they would allow and they were letting 10 people/families/units in every time a total of 10 came out. The total in the store was not overly crowded so they let a reasonable number of shoppers in initially. By the time we got in All TP was gone – limited 1 per customer unit. OK as we didn’t need any this week. We buy that at Costco beginning of the month and then just meat, frozen/fresh veggies and eggs, the rest of the month. Eggs – 100% gone, none even at opening. Milk spread out to cover. Not as much milk as usual either.
Meat cooler completely empty – multiple bins empty (the coolers that are open bins at wait level). No organic ground beef. No whole chickens. Only chicken thighs and breasts and they were almost out. Only 1 of each allowed per cart/customer unit. All stocks lowish/less than normal but meat, eggs, milk – out. Plenty of fresh veggies in comparison – not as much as usual but not what I would call low. Low on frozen veggies. People seemed calm but serious. A few seemed surprised (how can they be surprised at this point?!!!). Most carts were not piled high – just routine grocery shopping. some items limited and out but items that were there were not being stock piled.
We have been thinking and pondering – What explains VERY low stocks, empty shelves?
1) we know that there was a sudden surge in demand because
a) some people panic bought to the point of hoarding during an emergency (note: that is different than creating a surplus/being prepared by extra buying over a time span during normal circumstances
b) many people bought some extra, a week or two weeks extra in case they were sick and couldn’t go out or they have health conditions and didn’t want to go out after the virus came to their area
c) the shift from relying on businesses/schools for food to buy/receive to all personal consumption at home but a strain the system (as explained in SD’s article at OT)
OK – #1 explains why stocks would be low and there is not the same amount on the shelves. But it does not explain why #2 is happening
2) we now know that the supply chains seem to be disrupted because stores are not receiving their Normal deliveries much less companies putting on extra trucks to deliver and catch up with demand as companies do at Christmas time for example.
a) Korger is not receiving their usual delivers as told per sales people in the store this morning
b) When we called yesterday about when their next delivery trucks would arrive (we wanted Chicken, eggs and veggies) the harried and stressed customer service person told us he had no idea, that trucks were just showing up whenever and that the a TP delivery was 12 days late (much less all of the rest since then), that they had been expecting it just any time for 12 days and just took stock as it was delivered, when it was delivered at any old time.
c) stock trucks are coming into costco this morning and the product being taken directly to the floor in the middle of shopping hours – unusual!
–>> If supply chains were fine then stores would be low in stock anyway (see #1) but….
–>>If supply chains were fine then stores would receive their Normal deliveries, from their normal trucks on their normal schedule but they are not even receiving normal trucks/deliveries
–>If supply chains were fine, then normal supplies would continue to flow and extra trucks would be put into action to roll additional stock of TP, paper products, etc. out to the stores
Possible answers?
My husband watched an online video done by a trucker who claimed that there was extreme difficulty getting Scheduled deliveries done. He described being lined up with many other trucks at a grocery store for hours knowing he would be missing his 4pm scheduled delivery there. He said workers in the stores would go home at the end of shifts regardless of whether trucks got unloaded. Being late on any scheduled delivery set other later in the day scheduled deliveries back obviously.
Perhaps this is partly why Wal-Mart had announced big hiring activities, they need even more help to get trucks unloaded & items stocked. If stores are practicing “social distancing” for employees perhaps in certain areas they are limiting how they get activities done. Also, if stores are doing more cleaning than is typical they are tying up employees with those actions rather than what they would typically be doing.
It might be instructive to listen to “Red Eye Radio” 1am-5am (I think) Eastern Time to hear what the truckers call in to share. This show obviously caters to trucker based on much of the advertising that directly addresses trucking issues.
When I see the China playboy model! 😉 I think of this song
Going to see more and more creativity as a serendipity of people having down time at home. This was funny to me so sharing….
I have NO idea why that is SOOOOO big!
I loved it! Thank you MAGA Mom…………..
I just sa an aticle anout this. The pandemic TP use calculator.
Will you survive?
Use the advanced option. I wonder if they are accurate.
https://howmuchtoiletpaper.com/
Boy! Do I feel better, now!
http://sbly-web-prod.shareably.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/17135655/many_ways_to_use_toilet_paper_0.jpg