Sheep to the Slaughter

OK, to be honest I had Zero plans to write this post when I woke up “today”. In fact I’d been hoping to take advantage of my solo weekend to wrap up a post or two I’ve had in draft mode for months, but it appears that they’ll have to still wait. My hunters will be home soon…

This journey started out by reading Carl’s beautiful Sunday post.

Being very moved by the teaching he shared I wanted to look up the source material by John Piper AND finally came to a page that appears to contain much, or even all, that Carl shared, here:

https://www.desiringgod.org/messages/glory-majesty-dominion-and-authority-keep-us-safe-for-everlasting-joy

In the course of searching for the actual message, & not just other people’s blog posts about Piper’s teaching that was apparently given at some type of conference, a few interesting links popped up. One looked to be addressing how seemingly Piper weighed in on the 2020 election & from the couple lines of text visible at the search may have spoken against Trump. I was curious so went to read that article too.

https://notthebee.com/article/john-piper-wrote-a-weird-article-talking-about-the-freedom-to-be-vaxxed-and-james-white-had-some-thoughts-for-him

What a surprise to discover that the article was more about promoting the vax from the pulpit rather than steering people away from Trump during the stolen election. Hmmm

OK, so this post is NOT trying to attack John Piper as a man, a Christian, nor as a theologian. I’m trying to steer clear of my own biases, which is obviously impossible. In reading the search engine thumbnail descriptions it appears that Piper is affiliated with the Baptist church, which makes my “legalism radar” perk up. I’m just being honest, I have issues with legalism that go way back & have a (possibly misplaced) perception that Baptist takes might hover in the legalism domain…so grain of salt going forward here…

Here are a couple places where I’ve addressed legalism, & the other end of the spectrum, the prosperity gospel, for context on some of my thinking in these arenas…

So, back to the issue at hand. I like to think of myself as a Truth-seeker AND a Truth-teller. So let’s see if we can unearth some Truth in the controversy before us, namely shilling for the vax from the pulpit. Whom the Son sets free is Free indeed!

Let’s look into John Knox’s Not The Bee article a bit first. Per his opening remarks he appears to be a Conservative Christian, who is perhaps comfortable with MAGA & Trump’s leadership.

“I’m not here to slander John Piper. He’s a brother-in-Christ and a man who has, by all accounts, picked up his cross daily to preach the hope of Christ and Christ crucified to a broken world.

With that being said, Piper has come to some odd conclusions in recent years, starting most notably with the idea that voting for the worldly bravado of Donald Trump was just a [sic] morally wrong as the utter institutional corruption, unfettered support of abortion, and woke totalitarianism of Joe Biden.”

He then starts to dissect Piper’s article:

https://www.desiringgod.org/articles/a-reason-to-be-vaccinated-freedom

Let’s dive into Piper’s perspective without immediately referring to Knox’s take & see what might jump out…

Here is his opening & yikes he’s seeming like a Pro-vaxer from the outset, not just pro-freedom (in Christ).

My aim in this article is to encourage Christians to be vaccinated, if they can do so with a good conscience and judicious medical warrant.

The people I have especially in view are those who are not vaccinated because of fear of being out of step with people they respect, and in step with people they don’t admire. My message to them is simple: You are free.

So, I am not talking directly to everybody. If the shoe fits, put it on, check your conscience, consult your doctor, and go get vaccinated. If it doesn’t, go tearfully and cheerfully on your way. Tearfully, because over 4.5 million people have died from COVID-19 worldwide (including over 700,000 Americans). And cheerfully, because Christ makes it miraculously possible to love people by being “sorrowful yet always rejoicing” (2 Corinthians 6:10).”

So I’m pretty close to an anti-vaxer for numerous reasons now. It would be nearly impossible to read consistently here at The Q Tree & not be Extremely Concerned about the many & manifold dangers of the so-called Covid vaccine. Obviously Piper is coming from a very different worldview, though we Might be somewhat similar in our Christian biblical foundational viewpoints. Some of what he said above strikes me as manipulative, which is a big red flag to me!

Below is a comment written before the Plannedemic was on the scene with some vaccine concerns I expressed elsewhere, for perspective, but we’ll just stick with the Covid “vax” concerns today:

So Piper cites a number of sources that all seem to show that being unvax’d is Way more dangerous than being vax’d. Obviously here at the Q-Tree we consider material much more wider afield & also take into account the numerous reports, medical, scientific, & anecdotal that expose Much of the danger of the clot shots. It appears that Piper is unaware of this alternative & alarming material. Here’s his take, shudder:

When people respond to this increasingly clear reality by pointing to untrustworthy and disreputable government and medical leaders, I respond, “That’s a non sequitur.” The team called “vaccination” just made a first down, even if monkeys are holding the chains. For friends around the world who don’t know American football, that means a win is a win even if all the coaches and referees are incompetent.

Piper’s take on freedom is interesting & I encourage you to read it for yourself. He then lists a series of considerations to ponder as one decides for the shot or not. He doesn’t elaborate on those issues, even the implications of fetal cell lines, though he does link to a YouTube video on the topic. I have no idea if Piper is a pro-lifer or not, but at least he brings up that fetal tissue issue, though by implication doesn’t apparently consider it an impediment to Christians taking the “vax”. He appears to have made up his mind to take the shot & seems to be freeing, or even persuading, his parishioners to do the same–concerning!

Now let’s consider Knox’s other cited material that is opposed to Piper’s take before returning to Knox.

James White, the author of the above, pulls no punches & calls Piper out for his writings AND remarks on the election & the shot! Here is White pointing out what many Q-Treepers might consider to be quite obvious.

God’s ownership of our bodies implies our own stewardship thereof, which is why many of us take serious issue with experimental genetic therapies with record-breaking reports of adverse reactions, including death, with no long-term studies relating to safety (cancers, fertility), for a disease with an average mortality age above life expectancy and a mortality rate of less than 0.5%.

Further from White, bold is my take:

there is the arrogance of the secular worldview that actually leads man to believe he is wise enough, while remaining in rebellion against his Creator, to meddle with the very essence of his being (genetics). When such arrogance is joined with a lust for power and dominion, it becomes deadly.

So the bulk of the article, comprising numerous biblical citations about freedom, is not the issue. Instead, the problem is found in the section that reads like a Pfizer promotional advertisement, and then the application portion at the end.

White’s wisdom & Piper’s naivety are on display in this next quote from White (not italicised to preserve his presentation):

“From late October of 2020, as word about the technology that is behind the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines came out, I have stated that I would consider use of these vaccine [sic] once three and five year safety studies had been completed. Prior to 2020, this would have been considered a sober, even mundane position to take. You do not do genetic manipulation at “warp speed,” especially when the threat you are seeking to counteract is one that almost always requires multiple co-morbidities and results in an age of death equal to or above life expectancy. But we do not have such data, and with how this one particular disease has been handled, we have good grounds to wonder if we will ever have geniune [sic] data in the future. The VAERS database, maintained by the CDC, has catalogued record numbers of negative results from the vaccines, so it is now regularly dismissed as “untested” (the irony is palpable) by the media. The amazing reality that we are now counting deaths with the Covid-19 as the same as deaths from Covid-19 has resulted in massively inflated numbers, numbers Dr. Piper repeats without comment, and uses in his final argumentation as well. The fact is we are playing with dangerous and unknown long-term impacts with these types of experimental1 therapies. Dr. Piper does not even acknowledge this reality.”

Here is the material for the footnote #1 above & a reference to further work by White (an 8 page pdf). This appears to be a level of truth AND integrity to be much admired & emulated, yet too rarely seen!

1 Yes, they remain experimental. The FDA approved the Pfizer jab without public comment, fundamentally altering the entire process. Video exists of Anthony Fauci in 2019 (Milken Institute found on CSPAN2) lamenting how long it would take to get these kinds of vaccines approved. Given his own role in the Wuhan lab, gain-of-function funding, etc., the reality of the situation is clear.

Note: I have written a fuller statement on the basis for Christian rejection of vaccine mandates here: https://standwithwarriors.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/Statement-on-Christian-Faith-and-Mandated-Experimental-Medical-Procedures.pdf

AND White continues with his truth-telling…

“Many studies are now showing efficacy rates below 50% and dropping for these vaccines. But the UK report is even more dangerous. We are now seeing that the vaccines are inhibiting the natural ability to produce antibodies against not just the well-known “spike protein,” but against the shell of the virus as well. Our bodies provide not only a much more robust immunity (as all studies are showing, and which Dr. Piper misrepresented when he said natural immunity is “as effective as vaccination immunity” when it is actually 13 to 27 times greater), but it is a much wider immunity, responding to more of the structure of the virus. This study is telling us that vaccination degrades our natural immunity, leaving us even more exposed to future infection.”

And this treat from White on Piper!

“He then provides one of the most disappointing lines in the article: “You have pondered the likelihood and unlikelihood of conspiratorial conjectures.” Without defining his meaning, or providing examples, Piper does us no favors. Is the recognition of the cooperation of Big Tech and Big Pharma with the extreme leftists in political power resulting in the transfer of literally trillions of dollars of wealth a “conspiratorial conjecture”? Are the banishments from social media of medical experts who are warning about dangers fictional? We are not told.”

Winding down toward his conclusion White displays both insight AND wisdom:

“It is undeniable that the vaccines are not a solo issue. They are coming to us after mask mandates and church closures and pastoral imprisonments and before the next onerous demands from governments drunk on the power that inevitably comes from the rise of secularism. The secular state is far worse than the ancient pagan context of Rome (which was bad enough), for by its very definition it must be ultimate in all things as there is no Creator. Why Piper does not see the role the vaccines play in the overall demands of the newly empowered totalitarianism I cannot say, but it is not the first time he has missed the role a particular element plays in the whole. Mean, arrogant tweets are, in the overall scheme of things, significantly less important than the fact that the Biden regime is intent upon forcing your children to celebrate drag queens and likewise just as intent upon taking control of every aspect of your life to force you to live in denial of the lordship of Christ. What Piper has missed, badly, is the role these vaccinations play in a much bigger, much more basic movement into a technologically based, chemically and medically controlled secular totalitarianism.”

Obviously it is easier to resonate with White, at least for me. So let’s return to Knox. Piper is presented as

“…either unable or unwilling to see past the veneer of Everything is Fine™ that’s been peddled by the leftist politicians, the woke media, the “progressive” academy, and the neo-Marxist Big Tech offices.”

Knox reminds us to consider the source AND question conclusions drawn from faulty data & assumptions:

“As a math professor once told me, even if your calculations are 100% correct, your solution will be insanely wrong if your starting premises are off!”

Honestly I did enjoy reading all three pieces. Knox was my intro to the other two & his framing & take is invaluable. Piper was who I’d been searching for in appreciation of the Wonderful Teaching Carl shared with us today (now yesterday). Piper was shallow on facts but deeper on scripture in his writing compared to what the other two shared, but both Knox & White were addressing Piper’s factual fallacies more than his biblical prowess. Because I was reading Piper’s article as more of a vax skeptic, I found some of his scriptural insights to work on me in the opposite way than where he was going in his applications. White was factual, truthful, & masterfully insightful on both human nature & the creeping totalitarianism in our societies. I resonated with his take & hope to read further of how he also might “rightly divide the Word of Truth”!

I guess I would prefer to just hear from Piper on scripture, not social issues. Because White & Knox are seemingly aligned with my worldview they are more comfortable reads to me when addressing social &/or cultural concerns. Knox is an easier, quicker read, so he’s a good place to start. White dives in deep & dispenses truth, wisdom, & integrity quite liberally. Piper would do well to stick to biblical truth & could expand his sources of information so he has a better grasp of what is Really happening in the world today.

Now let’s turn to the reason for this post’s title, since many Shepherds (pastors & other leaders) are seemingly leading their flocks of Sheep to the metaphorical, if not literal, slaughter.

I’m going to share Ezekiel 34 in a moment, but this is how thinking along those lines developed, in the comments section on this excellent post by Wolfmoon:

Aubergine

AubergineOfflineCoyote October 17, 2021 08:58

AND logic.

There are markers in the vaccine, AND they are testing (using useless PCR) for infection, AND they are taking DNA.

All bases are covered. The sheep will see the “testing for viruses” part and be satisfied. The lions will see the markers and the DNA theft and walk majestically away.

They are flailing around trying anything they can think of to trick the lions into submission.

But I am a lion, and not subject to such gaslighting trickery.11 Reply

Wolf Moon

Wolf MoonOnlineAuthorWolf Reply to  Aubergine October 17, 2021 12:45

EXACTLY! That’s what I’m thinking. The small cheese was the vaccine in as many as possible. The BIG CHEESE was “everybody gives their DNA to the globonazis just to travel”. The really big cheese behind the scenes is “now we can modify and study every single person like a lab animal”. When we talked about being “controls”, they rubbed their hands in glee. “We can use that! We can surely use that!” The trick THERE is to foil that plan – to say “No, KlauSS. No DNA for you!”

One of the things they would surely be testing for would be immune function. Shedding. OMG. There is so much modification and study of us possible.

Once again….

comment image


Very clear who wants control.

“Bill Gates – Future Leader” one of them.

smiley2


smiley2OfflineCoyote Reply to  Aubergine October 17, 2021 13:13

pure lawlessness…

cleverly disguised as “peace and safety” for all !

and coming soon…

comment image


   marker

sounds like mark.

but we’re not quite there just yet.

the UN’s Sustainablity crap + the 2030 Agenda + the WEF + the Vatican + the Covid/Climate Change tyranny…and the global compliance to all of that…is creating Alinsky style chaos.

   they will need all the chaos they can manufacture…so that…

the machiavellian psychopath man of universal “peace” can show up, and quell all the chaos…

by then, ppl of the global village will have become rendered compliant enough so as to readily take the mark which will require, not just relinquishing our privacy, but something much worse : our souls.

to worship that man of lawlessness, perversion & lies.Last edited 7 days ago by smiley29 Reply

singingsoul1

singingsoul1OnlineWolverine Reply to  smiley2 October 17, 2021 15:09

We would be stronger if the Church leaders around the globe including Pop would stand with God’s people. They are not for a second time in history the past 80 years.
They failed God and humanity and will be judged more harshly for selling out God and Christ for a lousy bag of silver.4 Reply

Valerie Curren

Valerie CurrenOnlineCoyote Reply to  singingsoul1 October 18, 2021 04:36

The whole 34th chapter of Ezekiel is profoundly applicable Right Now!

Ezekiel 34
New International Version
The Lord Will Be Israel’s Shepherd
34 The word of the Lord came to me: “Son of man, prophesy against the shepherds of Israel; prophesy and say to them: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: Woe to you shepherds of Israel who only take care of yourselves! Should not shepherds take care of the flock? You eat the curds, clothe yourselves with the wool and slaughter the choice animals, but you do not take care of the flock. You have not strengthened the weak or healed the sick or bound up the injured. You have not brought back the strays or searched for the lost. You have ruled them harshly and brutally. So they were scattered because there was no shepherd, and when they were scattered they became food for all the wild animals. My sheep wandered over all the mountains and on every high hill. They were scattered over the whole earth, and no one searched or looked for them.

“‘Therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign Lord, because my flock lacks a shepherd and so has been plundered and has become food for all the wild animals, and because my shepherds did not search for my flock but cared for themselves rather than for my flock, therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: 10 This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I am against the shepherds and will hold them accountable for my flock. I will remove them from tending the flock so that the shepherds can no longer feed themselves. I will rescue my flock from their mouths, and it will no longer be food for them.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel%2034&version=NIV

Let’s add the rest of Ezekiel 34 (that wasn’t included in my original comment above) for perspective:


11 
“‘For this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I myself will search for my sheep and look after them. 12 As a shepherd looks after his scattered flock when he is with them, so will I look after my sheep. I will rescue them from all the places where they were scattered on a day of clouds and darkness. 13 I will bring them out from the nations and gather them from the countries, and I will bring them into their own land. I will pasture them on the mountains of Israel, in the ravines and in all the settlements in the land. 14 I will tend them in a good pasture, and the mountain heights of Israel will be their grazing land. There they will lie down in good grazing land, and there they will feed in a rich pasture on the mountains of Israel. 15 I myself will tend my sheep and have them lie down, declares the Sovereign Lord. 16 I will search for the lost and bring back the strays. I will bind up the injured and strengthen the weak, but the sleek and the strong I will destroy. I will shepherd the flock with justice.

17 “‘As for you, my flock, this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I will judge between one sheep and another, and between rams and goats. 18 Is it not enough for you to feed on the good pasture? Must you also trample the rest of your pasture with your feet? Is it not enough for you to drink clear water? Must you also muddy the rest with your feet? 19 Must my flock feed on what you have trampled and drink what you have muddied with your feet?

20 “‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says to them: See, I myself will judge between the fat sheep and the lean sheep. 21 Because you shove with flank and shoulder, butting all the weak sheep with your horns until you have driven them away, 22 I will save my flock, and they will no longer be plundered. I will judge between one sheep and another. 23 I will place over them one shepherd, my servant David, and he will tend them; he will tend them and be their shepherd. 24 I the Lord will be their God, and my servant David will be prince among them. I the Lord have spoken.

25 “‘I will make a covenant of peace with them and rid the land of savage beasts so that they may live in the wilderness and sleep in the forests in safety. 26 I will make them and the places surrounding my hill a blessing.[a] I will send down showers in season; there will be showers of blessing. 27 The trees will yield their fruit and the ground will yield its crops; the people will be secure in their land. They will know that I am the Lord, when I break the bars of their yoke and rescue them from the hands of those who enslaved them. 28 They will no longer be plundered by the nations, nor will wild animals devour them. They will live in safety, and no one will make them afraid. 29 I will provide for them a land renowned for its crops, and they will no longer be victims of famine in the land or bear the scorn of the nations. 30 Then they will know that I, the Lord their God, am with them and that they, the Israelites, are my people, declares the Sovereign Lord. 31 You are my sheep, the sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Sovereign Lord.’”

Footnotes

  1. Ezekiel 34:26 Or I will cause them and the places surrounding my hill to be named in blessings (see Gen. 48:20); or I will cause them and the places surrounding my hill to be seen as blessed

New International Version (NIV)

Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

Here is that same passage in a couple popular versions around the Q-Tree, the King James Version & the Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel+34&version=KJV

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Ezekiel+34&version=DRA

VC housekeeping note, footnotes from Bible Gateway show up as numbered here though they are lettered within the biblical text, please make adjustments (a=1, etc.).

I was going to expound on that passage but I think at this point it might be best for the Word of God to speak to your own heart as He wills…

Here is an example of a church that has gone overboard in the wrong direction, way beyond Piper’s vax persuasion. They wouldn’t allow the unvax’d to enter nor apparently work there, even those with medical or religious exemptions. I really hope the majority of the remaining flock got saline instead of the real clot shot!

https://notthebee.com/article/georgia-church-requiring-worshippers-to-show-proof-of-vaccination

Closer to home there have been disturbing trends. Our old home church seemed to go pretty overboard on Covid craziness. Earlier we visited to support a family member’s music ministry. At that time masks were strictly & personally enforced by deacons or elders, significantly impeding worship AND fellowship. They had Covid stations w/ hand sanitizer & masks positioned by entrances & strategically elsewhere in the building. Thankfully, over the summer the restrictions were relaxed as in people were encouraged to wear masks rather than “required”. At our daughter’s wedding there in August only a very small minority, like 2% of attendees, were pretty consistently masking.

My parents’ very large & prosperous church went through a season of only having online services. They spent exorbitant amounts of money to install various health measures including outfitting multiple gathering rooms w/ microbe killing lights, I believe. Since they also operate a Christian School they may have been proceeding with an abundance of caution. The online services were a blessing to my parents who may continue to do church that way when health or weather issues make attendance an hour away from home much more challenging. More churches having an online presence AND broadcasting services can be one of the seeming few positive changes since Covidiocy has mesmerized global sheep & tantalized totalitarians!

My husband has been very activie in music & leadership in a local church that might best be described as “seeker-friendly” & more youth oriented. This church is part of an extended church plant ministry in Michigan & most of the leadership are on the young side too. Michael, my husband, got one of our sons involved in music ministry there & our daughter-in-law was active in the children’s ministry. M & son got quite close to a Conservative Christian church employee who grew increasingly frustrated with various “woke” aspects of leadership that he was unable to sway whatsoever, even though he was on the church board. He finally moved out of state, largely to escape what was becoming toxic church culture.

Our son chose to leave because he couldn’t stand the mask mandates that were pretty heavy-handed for many months. Our daughter-in-law lost her motivation when they shut down all of the children’s ministry areas due to Covid lies. This church has had an extensive youth & children’s ministry & much outreach to the community. What had been a welcoming atmosphere, complete w/ complementary coffee & treats, turned into a desert of fear, in so many ways. Talk about serious mixed messaging…

My husband’s experiences with music there were becoming so frustrating compared to pre-covid freedoms. Significant enforced masking. No access to normal musician hang out rooms before or between services–much interpersonal ministry had occurred spontaneously in that environment previously. No longer were refreshments provided for the worship team (nor the church at large, for that matter). In fact they often had to wait in their cars when they weren’t on stage or in the service. Michael would hit a nearby drive-through & pick up cheap breakfast food to share with his team but it wasn’t even close to the same.

I attended service there at Easter & M had to RSVP so the church would have a head count & not get overcrowded. I’m not sure if they were attempting to limit numbers due to “social distancing” or what. Our son wasn’t able to make the RSVP cut so he stayed home on Easter, again. I refused to wear a mask & nobody called me on it, which was a relief. There were Many empty chairs so our son could likely have come too but the “restrictions” made the concept of joyfully coming into the House of the Lord pretty foreign–Tragic! Compared to the previous Easter, when virtually All Michigan churches were closed, this was an “improvement”. What a very twisted way to disrupt the celebration of Jesus’ Resurrection, the very lynchpin of the Church’s existence. Surely just accidental tyranny–NOT!

Although my husband Loves being a part of that music ministry AND has developed a number of quality relationships that have extended beyond just fellowship within the church walls, he has stated on numerous occasions that if that church ramps up the Covid crap again he is going to have to leave.

Churches bowing to government lies, tyranny, AND deception is transforming the natural areas of ministry that should be unfettered and subject to the leading of the Holy Spirit, Not the permission of The State! To see a pastor, like Piper, shilling for the death shots is beyond horrifying to me. Having ubiquitous masking & promoting fears & isolation & a lack of human contact (touch, hugging, holding hands to pray, shaking hands to greet others, laying hands on others in prayer &/or fellowship, facial expressions, etc.) are all destructive of the church & in effect are putting the Light of Christ under a metaphorical bushel.

Early in the Scamdemic when our dictator in the Governor’s mansion (Gretchen Half-Whitmer, to quote Trump) banned churches from being opened, or even people leaving their own households, we had a House Church service in our home. People from Four different households attended (family & pending family) and we were technically in violation of some illegitimate “mandate”. It was joyful, liberating, moving, godly, AND surreal. I wondered if we were, as a society, on the cusp of seeing the church driven underground, like in China or ancient Rome. Honestly our home church service was more meaningful & powerful with God’s presence than Any church building service I’d experienced in Many Years (my issues, not necessarily the church’s “fault”).

If driven underground The Church, The True Bride of Christ, will survive AND thrive…& suffer significantly…

In contrast to some of the above, other family members have been blessed to discover a vibrant & growing church about an hour away that did not bow the knee at Any level to the “pandemic” paralysis. Apparently this church has been on the front lines in fighting against illegitimate powers & even has some legal eagles in the congregation that have contributed significantly to clipping the Nazgul’s wings (Gretchen Whitmer). Standing up to tyranny may be One of the key factors why this church is growing so much right now.

I went to the church’s website to see if any of their Covid “activism” featured prominently, and it did not. Here is a link to an article from earlier in the scamdemic that quotes the pastor & gives context to his decision to keep their church open against manifest pressure from the system. It’s interesting given our hindsight view on much of what was happening then.

https://www.whmi.com/news/article/brighton-pastor-still-holding-in-person-services

Another distant family member, on the other side of the state, has recounted how her small community church has fared during the Covid manufactured “crisis”. Her church stayed mostly open, didn’t mask, & didn’t do social distancing. Many people got sick AND now have natural immunity. Many congregants are well-versed in alternative healing approaches to Covid & have been helping to bring healing to their community whenever the illness kicks in. I’ve shared some of her approaches here before & hope to do so more fully in another post…eventually.

Alarmingly on Detroit area TV there are a number of pastors featured prominently in Michigan propaganda pieces trying to still convince the masses of the importance of taking the clot shot. Every time I see one I think of Margaret Sanger’s desire to keep the “uppity” “undesirables” from thinking for themselves & not getting abortions. Basically the de-population agenda is still finding “spiritual shills” to sell their snake oil!

OK I went looking at Michigan.gov to see if I could find an example commercial featuring a faith leader & found this document on fetal cells & the “vax”. At the bottom are links to various faith organizations statements on the topic. I would guess the state isn’t linking to anyone who objects to the “vax” but am not taking the time to check. All of the links say Catholic or Vatican except the Charlotte Lozier Institute.

https://www.michigan.gov/documents/coronavirus/COVID-19_Vaccines_and_Fetal_Cells_031921_720415_7.pdf

Here is a link with a plethora of presumably propaganda materials promoting the clot shot from Michigan.

https://app.box.com/s/4cy0so8b5ux8dzmdcj5297bikvc4sejz

Here’s a link for the TV spots folder from the above file:

https://app.box.com/s/4cy0so8b5ux8dzmdcj5297bikvc4sejz/folder/129356162329

It looks like in order to view one needs to download the file. The top one tries to convince pregnant women the shot is safe. The seventh video features one of the pastors lamenting people dying alone. From the second from the bottom on page 2, link below, there is a spot on “keeping the faith”.

https://app.box.com/s/4cy0so8b5ux8dzmdcj5297bikvc4sejz/folder/129356162329?page=2

Just even considering this material makes me feel like I need to take a shower. This is like the PR campaign to convince people to willingly enter the Nazi cattle cars & showers, bringing about their own destruction!

Here’s an example of the kind of pastoral leadership I would much rather see!

Here’s the larger scene preceding that one:

I’ve spoken/written numerous times about movie-quoting as a language in our family, including at my inaugural Q-Tree post immediately below. Comments are closed now, but well worth reading. If someone might care to comment there is a copy of that post on my main blog, Special Connections, also below.

https://wqth.wordpress.com/2020/05/02/luna-wolf-pack/

Oh for a protective, patriotic pastor’s heart to arise in these dark days! Here is a possibility. I haven’t watched this video in full just share it for your consideration…It’s almost 2 hours & from earlier this month. Interestingly You Tube won’t allow that video to embed…hmm…just a glitch in the matrix surely!

Medical Freedom: Educate. Don’t Mandate.

1,072 views Streamed live on Oct 6, 2021

https://youtu.be/Vv0cvPPmRe0

Here is an appropriate warning from scripture for those who presume to teach others.

James 3:1 Not many of you should become teachers, my fellow believers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly

I went looking for some scriptures that might be applicable & encouraging in these dark days, here is truth!

2 Samuel 22 New International Version

David’s Song of Praise

22 David sang to the Lord the words of this song when the Lord delivered him from the hand of all his enemies and from the hand of Saul. He said:

“The Lord is my rock, my fortress and my deliverer;
    my God is my rock, in whom I take refuge,
    my shield[a] and the horn[b] of my salvation.
He is my stronghold, my refuge and my savior—
    from violent people you save me.

“I called to the Lord, who is worthy of praise,
    and have been saved from my enemies.
The waves of death swirled about me;
    the torrents of destruction overwhelmed me.
The cords of the grave coiled around me;
    the snares of death confronted me.

“In my distress I called to the Lord;
    I called out to my God.
From his temple he heard my voice;
    my cry came to his ears.
The earth trembled and quaked,
    the foundations of the heavens[c] shook;
    they trembled because he was angry.
Smoke rose from his nostrils;
    consuming fire came from his mouth,
    burning coals blazed out of it.
10 He parted the heavens and came down;
    dark clouds were under his feet.
11 He mounted the cherubim and flew;
    he soared[d] on the wings of the wind.
12 He made darkness his canopy around him—
    the dark[e] rain clouds of the sky.
13 Out of the brightness of his presence
    bolts of lightning blazed forth.
14 The Lord thundered from heaven;
    the voice of the Most High resounded.
15 He shot his arrows and scattered the enemy,
    with great bolts of lightning he routed them.
16 The valleys of the sea were exposed
    and the foundations of the earth laid bare
at the rebuke of the Lord,
    at the blast of breath from his nostrils.

17 “He reached down from on high and took hold of me;
    he drew me out of deep waters.
18 He rescued me from my powerful enemy,
    from my foes, who were too strong for me.
19 They confronted me in the day of my disaster,
    but the Lord was my support.
20 He brought me out into a spacious place;
    he rescued me because he delighted in me.

21 “The Lord has dealt with me according to my righteousness;
    according to the cleanness of my hands he has rewarded me.
22 For I have kept the ways of the Lord;
    I am not guilty of turning from my God.
23 All his laws are before me;
    I have not turned away from his decrees.
24 I have been blameless before him
    and have kept myself from sin.
25 The Lord has rewarded me according to my righteousness,
    according to my cleanness[f] in his sight.

26 “To the faithful you show yourself faithful,
    to the blameless you show yourself blameless,
27 to the pure you show yourself pure,
    but to the devious you show yourself shrewd.
28 You save the humble,
    but your eyes are on the haughty to bring them low.
29 You, Lord, are my lamp;
    the Lord turns my darkness into light.
30 With your help I can advance against a troop[g];
    with my God I can scale a wall.

31 “As for God, his way is perfect:
    The Lord’s word is flawless;
    he shields all who take refuge in him.
32 For who is God besides the Lord?
    And who is the Rock except our God?
33 It is God who arms me with strength[h]
    and keeps my way secure.
34 He makes my feet like the feet of a deer;
    he causes me to stand on the heights.
35 He trains my hands for battle;
    my arms can bend a bow of bronze.
36 You make your saving help my shield;
    your help has made[i] me great.
37 You provide a broad path for my feet,
    so that my ankles do not give way.

38 “I pursued my enemies and crushed them;
    I did not turn back till they were destroyed.
39 I crushed them completely, and they could not rise;
    they fell beneath my feet.
40 You armed me with strength for battle;
    you humbled my adversaries before me.
41 You made my enemies turn their backs in flight,
    and I destroyed my foes.
42 They cried for help, but there was no one to save them—
    to the Lord, but he did not answer.
43 I beat them as fine as the dust of the earth;
    I pounded and trampled them like mud in the streets.

44 “You have delivered me from the attacks of the peoples;
    you have preserved me as the head of nations.
People I did not know now serve me,
45     foreigners cower before me;
    as soon as they hear of me, they obey me.
46 They all lose heart;
    they come trembling[j] from their strongholds.

47 “The Lord lives! Praise be to my Rock!
    Exalted be my God, the Rock, my Savior!
48 He is the God who avenges me,
    who puts the nations under me,
49     who sets me free from my enemies.
You exalted me above my foes;
    from a violent man you rescued me.
50 Therefore I will praise you, Lord, among the nations;
    I will sing the praises of your name.

51 “He gives his king great victories;
    he shows unfailing kindness to his anointed,
    to David and his descendants forever.”

Footnotes

  1. 2 Samuel 22:3 Or sovereign
  2. 2 Samuel 22:3 Horn here symbolizes strength.
  3. 2 Samuel 22:8 Hebrew; Vulgate and Syriac (see also Psalm 18:7) mountains
  4. 2 Samuel 22:11 Many Hebrew manuscripts (see also Psalm 18:10); most Hebrew manuscripts appeared
  5. 2 Samuel 22:12 Septuagint (see also Psalm 18:11); Hebrew massed
  6. 2 Samuel 22:25 Hebrew; Septuagint and Vulgate (see also Psalm 18:24) to the cleanness of my hands
  7. 2 Samuel 22:30 Or can run through a barricade
  8. 2 Samuel 22:33 Dead Sea Scrolls, some Septuagint manuscripts, Vulgate and Syriac (see also Psalm 18:32); Masoretic Text who is my strong refuge
  9. 2 Samuel 22:36 Dead Sea Scrolls; Masoretic Text shield; / you stoop down to make
  10. 2 Samuel 22:46 Some Septuagint manuscripts and Vulgate (see also Psalm 18:45); Masoretic Text they arm themselves

New International Version (NIV)

Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

Here are links to the King James & Douay-Rheims versions for your convenience:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+Samuel+22&version=KJV

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=2+Samuel+22&version=DRA

Another passage filled with truth AND hope!

Job 5 New International Version

“But if I were you, I would appeal to God;
    I would lay my cause before him.
He performs wonders that cannot be fathomed,
    miracles that cannot be counted.
10 He provides rain for the earth;
    he sends water on the countryside.
11 The lowly he sets on high,
    and those who mourn are lifted to safety.
12 He thwarts the plans of the crafty,
    so that their hands achieve no success.
13 He catches the wise in their craftiness,
    and the schemes of the wily are swept away.
14 Darkness comes upon them in the daytime;
    at noon they grope as in the night.
15 He saves the needy from the sword in their mouth;
    he saves them from the clutches of the powerful.
16 So the poor have hope,
    and injustice shuts its mouth.

17 “Blessed is the one whom God corrects;
    so do not despise the discipline of the Almighty.[a]
18 For he wounds, but he also binds up;
    he injures, but his hands also heal.
19 From six calamities he will rescue you;
    in seven no harm will touch you.
20 In famine he will deliver you from death,
    and in battle from the stroke of the sword.
21 You will be protected from the lash of the tongue,
    and need not fear when destruction comes.
22 You will laugh at destruction and famine,
    and need not fear the wild animals.
23 For you will have a covenant with the stones of the field,
    and the wild animals will be at peace with you.
24 You will know that your tent is secure;
    you will take stock of your property and find nothing missing.
25 You will know that your children will be many,
    and your descendants like the grass of the earth.
26 You will come to the grave in full vigor,
    like sheaves gathered in season.

27 “We have examined this, and it is true.
    So hear it and apply it to yourself.”

Footnotes

  1. Job 5:17 Hebrew Shaddai; here and throughout Job

New International Version (NIV)

Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

Links to the KJV and the DRA:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Job+5&version=KJV

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Job+5&version=DRA

I’m searching for scriptures based on the word “rescue” AND there are Many. Here are more that leap out to me: Psalm 18; Isaiah 35; & II Peter 2. Also the many shared below!

Isaiah 46:4Even to your old age and gray hairs I am he, I am he who will sustain you. I have made you and I will carry you; I will sustain you and I will rescue you. In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations


  • Ezekiel 34:27
    The trees will yield their fruit and the ground will yield its crops; the people will be secure in their land. They will know that I am the Lord, when I break the bars of their yoke and rescue them from the hands of those who enslaved them. In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Daniel 3:28Then Nebuchadnezzar said, “Praise be to the God of Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, who has sent his angel and rescued his servants! They trusted in him and defied the king’s command and were willing to give up their lives rather than serve or worship any god except their own God. In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Daniel 6:27He rescues and he saves; he performs signs and wonders in the heavens and on the earth. He has rescued Daniel from the power of the lions.” In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Zephaniah 3:19At that time I will deal with all who oppressed you. I will rescue the lame; I will gather the exiles. I will give them praise and honor in every land where they have suffered shame. In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Luke 1:74to rescue us from the hand of our enemies, and to enable us to serve him without fear In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Acts 12:11Then Peter came to himself and said, “Now I know without a doubt that the Lord has sent his angel and rescued me from Herod’s clutches and from everything the Jewish people were hoping would happen.” In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations

Acts 26:16-18 New International Version

16 ‘Now get up and stand on your feet. I have appeared to you to appoint you as a servant and as a witness of what you have seen and will see of me. 17 I will rescue you from your own people and from the Gentiles. I am sending you to them 18 to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.’

2 Timothy 4:18 New International Version

18 The Lord will rescue me from every evil attack and will bring me safely to his heavenly kingdom. To him be glory for ever and ever. Amen. Read full chapter2 Timothy 4:18 in all English translations

As you can see from the numerous scriptures shared above God’s Word is full of hope for us all! Please dive in for yourself & see how God might speak directly to you in your hour of need from His Word!!!

Here is the passage I was originally searching for, Absolutely Applicable to pastors, leaders, AND to us all!

Proverbs 24:10-12 New International Version

Saying 25

10 If you falter in a time of trouble,
    how small is your strength!
11 Rescue those being led away to death;
    hold back those staggering toward slaughter.
12 If you say, “But we knew nothing about this,”
    does not he who weighs the heart perceive it?
Does not he who guards your life know it?
    Will he not repay everyone according to what they have done?

God grant us the wisdom, grace, AND strength to speak the truth in love AND to rescue those who are “staggering toward slaughter”.

Well God Bless you AND thank you for reading along with these thoughts today. I hope you are encouraged, inspired, AND challenged to go forth boldly proclaiming grace And truth. In Jesus Love, Valerie

VC note on use of AND throughout. This is a bit of an inside joke at The Q-Tree as Wolfmoon is fond of using the term “AND logic”, as in many times things aren’t either or but more like both AND…

PS, if this post has blessed you an earlier post reflecting on God’s intervention in our battles is below:

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[…] Sheep to the Slaughter […]

TheseTruths

Thank you for this post. I have not had time to read all of it in depth, but I was struck at the beginning regarding pastors and those who consider themselves Christian leaders who follow secular leading rather than standing on all of Scripture’s principles. IMO, they are misled, and some are preaching outright heresy. It is easy to get caught up in a group and be subtly led to unorthodox views. This is dangerous for people’s bodies and souls. We live in perilous times.

ForGodandCountry

So I’m pretty close to an anti-vaxer for numerous reasons now.

.
No, you’re not.

Speaking for myself, I reject ALL the labels the political left attempt to burden me with. They are free to label me as they will, but only I get to decide if I accept the label or not.

And let me be clear. I am not “anti-vax”.

To begin with, the COVID “vaccines” are NOT vaccines. They do not meet the classic, long-accepted definition of “vaccine”. No “vaccine” requires booster shots. This is why flu shots are called flu shots, not a flu vaccine.

Speaking of which, with regard to what are being called “vaccines” for COVID…

….REFUSING TO BECOME AN UNCOMPENSATED LAB RAT FOR A BIG PHARMA COMPANY WITH 100% LEGAL INDEMNITY FROM ANY HARM CAUSED BY THEIR PRODUCT IS NOT “ANTI-VAX”.

It’s common sense.

And I’m not getting into all the PROVEN HARM being caused by their EXPERIMENTAL COVID drugs.

I could go on and on….but the message is this…

DO NOT ACCEPT NOR USE THE LABELS THE LEFT WANTS TO PLACE UPON YOU. REJECT THEM, AND THE THINKING THAT LIES BEHIND THEM.

After all, Valarie, would you accept the left labeling you “anti-Christian” under ANY circumstances?

Because THAT is coming.

Disagree with or refute Pope Francis? You’re not a “christian”.

LMAO

Yeah, the left ….NOR ANYONE ELSE…..does not define me, doesn’t get to make me carry the burden of the labels they want to place on me, and in general can go stuff itself.

If I am “anti-vax”, then the left is utterly “brainwashed”.

Last edited 1 month ago by ForGodandCountry
Wolf Moon

AMEN! Great position.

Deplorable Patriot
Brave and Free

Thanks Valerie, definitely a lot to take in. The point I see is not only is the chaff in the ruling class being separated, but in the church as well. I’ve been seeing this more as I search deeply into God’s word for a better understanding of these times were currently in.
God Bless sister.

Cuppa Covfefe

Well said. Evangelical Dark web has articles about various pastors “evangelizing” for the clot shot. It’s disturbing how sometimes those who are expected to exhibit great discernment in spiritual matters are so careless in other matters. Perhaps a misplaced “professional courtesy” of sorts…

Here’s their (his) article about John Piper’s take on things:
https://evangelicaldarkweb.org/2021/10/20/john-piper-lies-peddles-big-pharma-narrative

(Funny thing, I printed one of Evangelical Dark Web’s articles out and my wife took it to her women’s bible study. Some of them were skeptical because it said “Dark Web”. The connection (OK, obscure joke/pun) doesn’t translate too well, so she got to explain that, too 😀 )….

Piper, like many others, seems to have veered left over the years. I think Chuck Swindoll has as well. John Macarthur seems to be rock solid in his stance and beliefs, and his fighting Kalifornistan (and winning, THANK GOD!) and standing up for keeping churches open in the plannedemic is a blessing.

To paraphrase Alexander Hamilton and Aaron Tippin, if you don’t stand up for what’s right, you’ll fall for anything… (yep, quite a mix there 🙂 )….

Grandmaintexas

Valerie, thank you for taking the time to assemble these wonderful Scriptures.

It is horrible how many Christian leaders have been led astray.

I am shocked, frankly, at how weak and worldly they are. But then, if Christian leaders had been awake perhaps we might not now be on the verge of totalitarianism.

Wolf Moon

AMEN! This!

From the beginning of discussion, I was shocked that the pastor (Piper) who was encouraging people to GET the shot without peer pressure, did NOT likewise encourage people to NOT get the shot despite peer pressure to get it.

That lack of balance struck me as disingenuous.

In contrast, the criticizing pastor (White) was up-to-the-moment on the fact that the vaccines are not only useless – they are corrupting normal immunity, and are in fact now DANGEROUS.

This whole episode has been eye-opening. Our government has been taken over by CRIMINALS and MADMEN, and our religious leaders are weak and unwise, just like the con-men left over when Martin Luther King, Jr was killed.

Deplorable Patriot

At this point, the divisiveness is appalling. You should see the arguments on Catholic Twitter. Anyone who has done their own research, and followed the physicians and scientists risking everyone to tell the truth are pretty much ridiculed because the bulk of the hierarchy – not all, but a lot – are spineless cowards.

Deplorable Patriot

They conduct pretzel logic to justify what they’ve always been told: vaccines save lives. Never mind that no one ever said that aborted fetal tissue has been used to develop them for decades.

Do vaccines really save lives? Other than the rabies vaccine, do they really? One pediatrician did a study on his own patients and looked at the actual data and his results got him in hot water. Among his patients, the data does not support the healthier conclusion.

RDS

RED ALERT  🔴 
Let’s talk about SHEEP TO THE SLAUGHTER — YOUNG CHILDREN AND THE PFIZER “VACCINE”

http://www.fda.gov/media/153447/download
FDA Briefing Document
“EUA amendment request for Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine for use in children 5 to 11 years of age”

This is the template for the “discussion” that will happen TOMORROW at the FDA VRBPAC meeting to grant the EUA requested by Pfizer-BioNTech to shoot up young children in the Unites States with the CCP”Fauci-Mengele” virus “vaccine.”
Unless the Almighty God Himself intervenes, the EUA will be granted.
From there, the CDC will likely sign off on the EUA.

Page 9 of the FDA document spells out the EUAs granted for prophylaxis and treatment use for COVID-19. There is NO MENTION AT ALL of Ivermectin OR HCQ being DENIED an EUA for prophylactic or treatment use among the other products listed.

Page 10ff talks about COMIRNATY. One will find it a classic exhibition of parsel-tongue, “Fauci-speak” and downright lies. The FDA went ahead and CHANGED THE NAME of the PfizerUSA “vaccine” from the original BNT162b2, to “Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine”, to legally tie tie the old BNT162b2 product to the BIoNTech German-made product, “COMIRNATY.” The FDA thus said that the two DIFFERENT products are LEGALLY the same, but not CHEMICALLY the same. And the are NOT chemically the same — COMIRNATY contains MORE of the spike protein compared to the BNT162b2 product, among other differences.

The data cited by the FDA in the document are ONLY the data supplied by Pfizer which purported to “prove” that its two “vaccine” products had above 95% “safety and efficacy.” There is NO data that I can see that refers to the HUGE DECLINE in “safety and efficacy” that appear several weeks / months POST-“vaccination.”

Page 22 talks about the amount of titers in the blood of children ages 5- 11 at one month “post-vaccination” with the BNT162b2 product. This is the level of antibody load from the spike protein in the “vaccine”. The level for this age group is an average of 1197.6 — this appears to be high load of spike protein-induced antibody reaction.

Page 24ff talks about the “safety studies” that were performed on the 1,528 volunteers ages 5 – 11, who got the BNT162b2 “vaccine.” ONLY 1073 of these volunteers WERE IN THE UNITED STATES. The FDA appears to claim that any incidences of adverse reactions were minimal enough as to be statistically insignificant.

THE FDA IS USING A “STUDY” THAT HAD 1,073 U.S. VOLUNTEERS AGES 5 – 11 TO JUSTIFY AN EUA FOR USING THE BNT162b2 “VACCINE” ON 28 MILLION CHILDFREN IN THE U.S. AGES 5 – 11.

The other “study” cited by the FDA in the document, C4591007 (using the BNT162b2 “vaccine” in young children), and WHICH IS REFFERED TO AS AN “ONGOING CLINICAL TRIAL” in the document, and which the FDA is using “data” collected UP TO OCTOBER 7, 2021, IS GOING ON UNTIL JUNE 18, 2024. (https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04816643)

ANY CHILD ages 5 – 11 getting the Pfizer “vaccine” IS A HUMAN LAB RAT.

Page 33 of the FDA document: “…the overall benefits of the vaccine may still outweigh the risks…”

Last edited 1 month ago by RDS
Wolf Moon

“….MAY still outweigh the risks….”?????!!!!!

And they’re going to MANDATE or FEED MANDATES based on that?

To HELL with these monsters.

RDS

CLARIFICATION:

The FDA letters of August 23, 2021, that “fully approved” the use of COMIRNATY and EXTENDED the original EUA for the PfizerUSA “vaccine”, BNT162b2, stated that the two “vaccines” were DIFFERENT LEGAL entities but were IDENTICAL “VACCINES.”

Dr. Janet Woodcock (Acting Head of the FDA) LIED about the two “vaccines” being IDENTICAL in terms of their makeup. COMIRNATY has a DIFFERENT FORMULATION compared to PfizerUSA’a “vaccine”, BNT162b2.

COMIRNATY has 25% MORE of the spike protein;
COMIRNATY has 34% MORE of the polyethylene glycol;
COMIRNATY has 1,070% MORE of the potassium chloride;
COMIRNATY has an UNLISTED INGREDIENT called “Redacted Ingredient” — compared to BNT162b2.
https://amgreatness.com/2021/10/19/defense-department-pulls-a-bait-and-switch-on-vaccines/

However, MEDICAL INSTITUTIONS are REPEATING the FDA lie that the two “vaccines” are IDENTICAL:
http://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/you-asked-we-answered-are-pfizers-comirnatry-and-and-biontech-covid-19-vaccines-the-same-or-different
The statement from their Infections Disease pharmacist, BRYAN ALEXANDER, PharmD:
“In terms of what is contained inside the vial of each they are identical. Pfizer and BioNTech simply formally “branded” or named their vaccine Comirnaty.”

This statement is a LIE.
The FDA CANNOT “fully approve” the PfizerUSA “vaccine” BNT162b2, because it is STILL in clinical trials in the United States.

Wolf Moon

Thanks for this very well-considered analysis. My take-home message is that THE FLOCK persists because GOD WILL TEND when the shepherds go astray.

This blog is an ESSENTIAL part of that persistence. Leaders may stumble, but there are plenty of believers here who will carry God’s message faithfully despite that failure.

TRUTH is our standard. Whether one calls it “information”, “disinformation”, “counseling”, propaganda, brainwashing – WHATEVER – means nothing.

IS IT TRUE?

That is the question, and no person is forbidden to address that question, as we come to our conclusions.

Wolf Moon

“Leaders may stumble!” 😆

Linda

Amen, Valerie! I’ve been pretty disgusted right from the first at how many pastors are abdicating their responsibility to lead people based on what God has said in His word. And there are a lot of them. From Franklin Graham saying that Jesus would get the shot (I can’t think of many things more blasphemous then saying the Great Physician would take a gene altering shot!) to pastors who mindlessly closed down their churches and followed every whim of the governors without even so much as a whimper to all those encouraging people to get the shots.

I posted here about our assistant pastor emailing everyone to let them know where to get the shots. As far as I know, most of the church got vaccinated. Maybe partly because none of the leadership said it was wrong. And yet every one of them is adamantly Pro Life. That just doesn’t compute to me. My mother did the same at the urging of my nephew. But at least she has an excuse. She has Parkinson’s and can’t remember from one hour to the next what you’ve told her.

RedLegLeader68

Well, that was awesome!!

ForGodandCountry

Re: labels like “anti-vax”…

Satan himself would love nothing better than to get people psychologically conditioned to accept the labels his minions place upon them.

Like “anti-vax”.

If successful, then HE gets to define what is…say….christian and what isn’t, not the bible (ie. God’s living word).

So, the unwary, label-accepting christian is labeled “unChristian” for rejecting things like gay marriage, and then said christian folds and supports gay marriage in order to avoid the label.

I say….

Fuck you, Satan. YOU and your vile little minions don’t get to label me anything, I refuse and reject your (and the political left’s…as well as RINO…) labels. I will NOT be burdened by disingenuous, false, untrue, MANIPULATIVE labels in your attempt to coerce me into dishonoring and turning my back on Jesus Christ.

YOU don’t get to label me. God, and God ALONE, has that power and privilege. And HIS labels are the ONLY ones with which I will concern myself.

I openly mock and ridicule any label the God-hating left attempts to impose upon me.

”Anti-vax” or any other.

.

Last edited 1 month ago by ForGodandCountry
Grandmaintexas

Just had the inevitable break from a relative who accused us of being anti-vaxxers…

singularzoe

I don’t think my two previous attempts to comment posted. Thank you, Valerie. Great post and James White really nailed it. Religious leaders or pastors who guilt, goad or otherwise manipulate the flock, misusing scripture to do so are hirelings, and our Lord had a lot to say about them. Linda, TheseTruths, Wolfmooon, Cuppa and especially ForGodandCountry, thank you for the great comments.

Grandmaintexas

Thank you for persisting.

TradeBait2

Thank you, Valerie. Will need to dedicate some more time to follow the links. I appreciate the scripture references. Nothing needs to be added or taken away – The Word speaks.

There have been many Christian pastors and theologians who have strayed from their calling; if indeed they were called by the Lord. Piper is just one of many it appears. I don’t need to explain how he is in conflict with scripture. Most on here already know. White and Knox offer strong counters.

When it comes to the “calling” of the Lord to preach The Word to all the nations – He called His disciples. You can always spot the disciple wannabes and neverbeens – they wither and move away from the fire when it gets hot. The cost is too high.

The calling involves taking up your Cross and following Him daily. We answer the calling and the Lord decides the beginning, the end and the results of the calling. In Piper’s comments I am reading condescending worldly judgment of those who do not agree with how he sees the world – a full blooded cultural charlatan. He may not have started out that way, but he has arrived there now.

One final thing – I submit that any person who claims to be pro-choice and also a Christian might want to rethink their position. I really don’t see Jesus appreciating the support of the murder of innocent children based on His words, actions and mission. Moloch maybe, but not Jesus.

TradeBait2

Good points and understood, Valerie. I have no right to judge Piper – that’s the Lord’s job alone. Just seeking the truth first. I call out my own lies and sins quicker than I do others. My knees are worn out as a result. 😄 However, when a leader or teacher gives even 99% truth and 1% falsehood, it is tainted and the Father of Lies approves because it leads the unwitting sheep astray.

No man (Piper) has the right to judge any person or collective of Christians in this case for decisions made after thoughtful prayer and consideration of all known facts. He did. Not only does he do that, he uses his figurative pulpit and standing for the purpose of leading them astray. That makes him a charlatan to use his position of perceived authority as a pastor/theologian to sell something over which he has no authority or even practical knowledge as it turns out. He literally chooses to be a minion for our evil government leaders. That’s a Pharisee. Jesus did not let that approach slide even with Peter as you rightly state/quote. As His disciples He gave them authority to do the actions and teach as He did. Nothing more, nothing less. But when devoted Peter spoke against His/Father’s will, He told Peter to, “Get thee behind me, Satan.” FWIW He used similar words in Matt. 4:10 when addressing the devil during His temptation period. Pretty strong words for a devoted disciple, pretty strong admonishment for all of us who follow Him and want to be His disciples..

So to bring my point closer to a conclusion – Piper does not have the authority to lead people in matters he was not given in any calling that he may or may not have received by the Lord. In this situation he grabbed authority he was not given to influence many others on something unrelated to His assignment if he has received the calling. It is OK to simply keep your mouth shut on matters of which you have not been given authority to lead others. Had Peter continued to work against Jesus, he would no longer have been His disciple. That would not have declared anything Peter had done in support of Jesus and His work invalid from the past. It would simply mean Peter’s calling had ended unless he confessed his sin, repented, and was restored by Jesus. Peter would no longer have authority to act on the Lord’s behalf until that happened.

There are procedures in the Lord’s church for addressing sin of members and even elders, which would be Piper in this case. Matthew by Jesus, I Corinthians, Galatians, Titus and in I Timothy 5:20 we find even an elder should be publicly rebuked. Maybe more of us (including me) should be doing what the Word says and we would have far less division in the Lord’s house.

Again, thanks for your great work here.

Last edited 1 month ago by TradeBait2
TradeBait2

👍🙏

You are such a light – I have been blessed by you more than you know. That blessing then becomes the ripples on the water that goes to others. Love learning and discussing with fellow brothers and sisters in Christ.

TradeBait2

It hurts my heart every time I think about it, Valerie. It literally makes me sick to my stomach and I am not a young man anymore. I have seen and been through a lot of garbage in my life. Handled it all with the Lord’s help. But, murdering babies and abusing children makes me lose it. How dare they?! How could any human being do that to another innocent human being? But many in our science and medical industries not only support it, they institutionalized it with the support of our government and judiciary. Evil to the core.

It is literally all you need to know to understand how evil is in charge of our country and much of the world. Once you accept that fact, you see through all the other stuff like COVID, recreational drug promotion, sexual perversion being mainstreamed, etc. We are all touched in some way and need the Lord’s forgiveness for not doing all we can to stop it, which starts with sharing Jesus with everybody. Once you accept Him and He knows you as His own – everything changes.

TradeBait2

Spot on, Valerie. We are in 100% agreement. It’s why I ceased being linked or perceived as a supporter of either political party. I was linked to both sides of the aisle at various times in my life. But there was always the qualifier, the litmus test as they liked to call it. When I saw too much on both sides I withdrew from both, but still have my litmus test and always will. The decision to withdraw came after non-paid lobbying for our industry in the halls of Congress. Never felt so much like a fish out of water in all my life. Needed to be fumigated to get the stench off afterwards. It was not my calling to continue to navigate through that maze.

When it comes to my voting, it is always a decision that best reflects Christ’s will. Period. It comes at a price. I have lost employment as a result of paying that price. I have also failed each time I did things my or the world’s way. I succeeded each time I did it the Lord’s way. Funny how that works. Also very satisfying because He confirmed each time just how much He loves me. Rewarded or disciplined – it’s knowing the Father loves me enough to provide both is what counts. I no longer test Him like I once did. I would rather please Him as well as myself by being in sync. From your comments it is clear that you are in that same camp.

Be blessed.

TradeBait2

I believe you are seeing through that glass more clearly than you think.

When doubting the “voice” – this is what has proven effective for me. I simply go to scripture and wait. Sometimes it will jump off the page at me, other times nothing. Those times I move on to other things and return to it when He brings it back to mind. There are times He uses the words of another person, but most times it is through scripture and prayer with me.

The answer will come to your mind and heart when He is ready to provide. Meanwhile we are to continue to labor in the fields as they are ripe for the harvest.

TradeBait2

I could tells short stories all day. 😄

I sat in the office of one older Senate committee chair who could not hide her embarrassing affection for the Senate Majority Leader (not McConnell). The SML was supporting our position on some industry issues. I had to steer the subject back to the issues two times in a 30 minute meeting. She could not contain her admiration. lol. If I said her name you would probably be able to find a scandal or two in her background.

Meanwhile during the visit the opposition ranking Vice Chairman’s aide/spokesperson was lambasting her own boss over the issues that were costing people jobs needlessly. Everybody would know if I stated his name (and probably agree with her). Her boss was basically extorting the issues to get something he wanted in return in unrelated bills. Making mischief as the SML’s aide told me before they were able to finally cut a deal.

FWIW – on one visit I was ridiculed for wearing a button down shirt with my expensive suit by a lobbyist. To my face. He knew I was from Tennessee, so hillbilly entered his mind. He was right – I am. I asked him if had ever read and considered the words in the song Rocky Top. For some reason he never came around or talked to me again. 😂 Oh well…

There’s a lot more – but it would just run on an on. It’s nasty.

wheatietoo

Thank you, Valerie, for the heads up on John Piper and for all your insights from your deep dive into this!
 👏  😍 

Thank you for being such a truth-seeker and for sharing your findings with us!
Much appreciated!

smiley2

I’d like to second that !

thanks, Valerie !  👍 

labor of love.

smiley2

#1 it’s not a “vaccine”.

#2 I am anti-MANDATE…anti-COMPLIANCE…

#3 there is no informed CONSENT…

#4 I am anti-GENOCIDE.

#5 I am anti-MEDICAL TYRANNY.



smiley2

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 👉  take only the ways that are straight.

smiley2

you too, Valerie.  💞 

GA/FL

Piper is obviously operating on sentiment, idealism, theory, theology – but he is detached from science, reality, statistics that reveal the actual adverse effects, the actual harm and the actual inefficacy of the vaccines.

Likewise, Piper decried Trump because of surface appearances (Trump was rude, mean, etc.) rather than broader principles (American jobs, economy, energy independence, integrity, security).

I’ve never listened to Piper – when I tried to hear him, I always felt a bit uneasy with his sermons, never felt he was preaching the whole truth of the Gospel of the Faith of Jesus Christ. I’m more of a David Jeremiah, Chuck Swindoll, Tony Evans sort of girl.

GA/FL

I’m no one to use as a measure of John Piper or any other teacher. I have ‘issues, bad choices, bad judgment, baggage, abnormalities and failings’ galore.

I do have some familiarity with Scripture, theology and church doctrine. Piper repels me rather than draws/feeds/enlightens.

GA/FL

John Piper bugs me the same way Scott Adams does.

GrammyInD

Thank you, Valerie, for taking the time to put all of this together. Here is my two cents:

I have profited from reading both Piper and White in years past but was left shaking my head after reading Piper’s comments prior to the 2020 election. Hadn’t heard his take on the vax, yet.

A good friend of mine said at the beginning of the covid lockdowns, “This is a judgement from God.” I couldn’t quite follow her reasoning at the moment and we actually are on opposite sides of the fence in many aspects of the whole covid thing. But we have enjoyed friendship and fellowship for several decades and she and her husband are definitely prayer warriors. After seeing what has been happening in many churches we know, I would agree with her now, according to 1 Peter 4:17: For the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God?

We have seen churches divided, some continuing till now with online-only services, some completely shut down, some completely ignoring all the mandates, many with at least partial obedience to the governments demands. The following is our story.

To make it short, I will simply say that our church at the time (we had been members for 10 years and they had supported our missionary work for 20) went through all the usual stages of online-only services to online plus in-person but with masks and distancing…whatever the government said was necessary for “large gatherings”. My husband had cautioned at the beginning that there would be differences of opinion and conscience and the bottom line must be to respect those differences, no matter what the official church position. But more and more, we began to see that those who were government-conform in their thinking began presuring others. People would whisper their dissent, if at all, and open discussion was prevented. The same machinations we have come to see at government levels began to manifest themselves in the church. There were back-room decisions made, any who did not conform to “we must obey the government at all costs” were mobbed and bullied and cast as dangerous outsiders, even one elder and a respected teacher. Finally, several left. Corona did not divide the church, it only made visible and magnified the ungodly attitudes already at work.

Those of us who left started meeting together in homes, not actually intending to start a new church. But the more we met on the basis of

Matthew 18:20 Where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them. and

Acts 2:42 And they continued steadfastly in the spostles’ doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers,

the less we wanted to go look for other churches to attend. So we now consider ourselves a “mobile house church”, or, as my husband likes to call it, a “guerilla gathering”. We take turns hosting worship and teaching with a meal afterwards and meet at a christian drug rehab center where several work for mid-week Bible study shared with those from rehab who are interested. We have been more than blessed. It is certainly challenging, but definitely worth the extra effort.

These two verses above are the basis on which my husband has planted/helped plant numerous churches in many countries for almost 4 decades. Interestingly, BEFORE covid happened, he said he thought a time would come when house churches might be the only way. As a church, we are preparing for more difficult times, should they come, although things are not as bad here now as they had been in previous months. This, for us, is the hill to die on. We will not abandon biblical worship and biblical compassion for others, including hugs, singing, shaking hands, looking at each others’ faces and visiting/supporting the sick instead of fearing them.

Maranatha!

Last edited 1 month ago by GrammyInD
Tonawanda

Great comment!

Just as schools are moving into homes, it seems the Church will also.

Grandmaintexas
singularzoe

Smiley2, love your little list. Thank you, Valerie and all who responded. Grammy, appreciate your love of the Lord.

Tonawanda

Beautifully thoughtful, meaningful and insightful post, Valerie!

I read your linked personal essay on legalism and had a lot to say about it, but then realized a response to the essay in this thread would be misplaced. But that post, too, was beautifully thoughtful, meaningful and insightful.

WRT Piper: his purported lack of discernment can mean many things, and I do not exclude any possibility, but none are good. It may even be actual abject ignorance, although such ignorance if true necessarily raises character issues or psychological issues.

One of the things I was going to mention in response to your legalism essay I will say here. I am reading Elmer Gantry. Yes, its premise is based on sneering at Christianity. But it is a brilliant book which could IMO be of great benefit for Christians to read. The character studies are true to life, and broadly applicable.

In a completely unintended way, Lewis is perfectly illustrating the truth and meaning of what Jesus meant in His warnings against falsity.

GrammyInD

Partly because of “sheep” in the title and partly because of the mention of house churches in the discussion, I would like to recommend a book for long fall/winter evenings:

Bold as a Lamb by Ken Anderson

Description from http://www.christianbook.com:

Bold as a Lamb is the true story of Pastor Samuel Lamb. Imprisoned for more than twenty years for preaching the Gospel, he became the beloved secret pastor to hundreds of fellow inmates. After his release in 1978, he built a phenomenal “house church” congregation of more than a thousand. Soon, however, he became the special target of those determined to destroy the mushrooming house church movement in China. His church was closed and his ministry tools were confiscated. Yet this man remains undaunted, standing boldly and with spiritual grace-against fierce opposition. This is the fascinating, eye-opening account of one of China’s best-known pastors, his dauntless congregation, and how they found joy and optimism in the face of relentless persecution.

I have recently begun to re-read this. It is definitely an encouragement to stand firm in the face of difficulties/persecution.

Zorro rides

Valerie, I just wanted to pop in here, at the bottom, to say your authorship in QTree was significant to me today. Thank you.