Happy Hanukkah 2019!

This year, Hanukkah is extra-special, because it coincides strongly with Christmas, beginning on sundown of December 22. And what better President than TRUMP to help us celebrate both Holidays!

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/presidential-message-hanukkah-2019/

Hanukkah isn’t a flashy holiday. It’s a quiet but important one – about keeping the faith, rekindling the faith, and celebrating the faith. So more than just being glad for Jews everywhere who will be celebrating – whoever you are – let me suggest that you think about taking a quiet moment to take in the Hanukkah spirit and renew your faith in God. Take your faith to the next level!

Dark to light, friends!

W

https://www.calendardate.com/hanukkah_2019.htm

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[…] Happy Hanukkah 2019! […]

duchess01

Beautiful Thread, Wolf – Thanks! God Bless You!!!

duchess01

* Smile *

Plain Jane

Yes, beautiful, this thread just had a much needed calming effect on me. It also reminded me that ever since I can remember, I thought that if I was not RC, my faith would be Jewish. Which also reminds me that the Catholic faith is intertwined with and started with the Jews.

Plain Jane

Awesome and thoughtful and stimulating treatment of the subject Wolfie. Thank you

highlander

—“greedy for God” —great phrase. ~~~That’s me too….ever since God showed up when I was 17, scooped me up in His arms and all I knew—-what every cell in my body knew—- was “God IS…God is Love….God loves ME…” “Love” -feels real good, whatever form it comes in (lover’s embrace, pet’s enthusiastic welcome, touch of the Divine at Midnight Mass, a friend’s steady presence in time of need)——feels REAL good. We do not forget, and want more—and yes, get greedy for more God/ of His loving touches.
ps: —in the twinkling of an eye on that occasion I went from total atheist to——-His. Such is the nature of our God. I wasn’t looking, hadn’t asked but He knew how much i needed Him and He came to get me.
Praise God praise God.
~~~~~MERRY CHRISTMAS Treepers!–you’re ALL wonderful; we are all so blessed. Thank you Wolfie for this great hangout.
Love to all—-L.

highlander

——and, God’s richest blessings on all who are celebrating Hanukkah !
Be well; be blessed—-L.

Gail Combs

Religions are ‘man made’ because of our limited understanding. Who is to say that God, in his infinite wisdom, did not make allowances for our limitations and provide mankind multiple ways?
I find it hard to believe that good, honest, kind…. Hindus or Jews or others are headed to Hell because they do not believe as Christians do, while some not so nice Christians are headed to heaven because they repent.

Deplorable Patriot

Here’s the thing about Christianity being a Jewish sect (in Catholicism it’s called “fulfillment” of Judaism)…you have to include the Scripture that Christ would have known which includes the Helenistic Canon (the books of Baruch, Sirach, Wisdom, Judith, 1&2 Maccabees, and Tobit) which are excluded in the Masoretic Text which is used as the Hebrew Scripture today. A LOT, and I mean A LOT, of what Christ has to say is included in those seven books that the Jerusalem Jews of the immediate post-Christ period did not want in their Holy Books. Martin Luther switched out the original (the Septuagint) for the Masoretic Text, so protestants don’t know those seven books, but Christ certainly did. I mean, there are passages in Sirach and Wisdom that are almost identical.
Just another data point for consideration.
The celebration of light…we have the Advent wreath and lights on evergreen trees which are a symbol of new birth. Our friends the Jews have their lights. It’s a dark time of year, naturally. That doesn’t mean we need to give into the darkness.

Deplorable Patriot

I meant there are passages from Sirach and WIsdom that are almost identical to what Christ said.

NYGuy54

Judaism is not a sect of Christianity. That is total nonsense.

Deplorable Patriot

No, I meant it the other way around. That’s the way it was seen. Still is to an extent.

trumpismine

That article is more evidence of the horror of the holocaust. Amazing the deniers are still ignorant of the Truth.
God curse those who are doomed to repeat the history of hate and genocide. What a stain on humanity

grandmaintexas

There is a wonderful book: Salvation is from the Jews, by Roy H. Schoeman, a Jewish Catholic.
From the back cover: “This book traces the role of Judaism and the Jewish people in God’s plan for the salvation of mankind, from Abraham through the Secind Coming, as revealed by the Catholic faith and by a thoughtful examination of history. It will give both Jews and Christians a deeper understanding of Judaism, both as a religion in itself and as a central component of salvation history….”
It addresses Messianic prophecies in Jewish lit, the anti-Christian roots of Nazi anti-semitism, links between the Nazis and Arab anti-semitism and so much more.
One of the best books I’ve read on the subject.

grandmaintexas

This was for Jane.

Plain Jane

Thanky you Grandma. Bookmarked his site. Saw also that he has a trip to the Holy Land in May….maybe I can get the knee doc to up my second knee surgery…I wanna go.

geneticallycatholic

Hi PJ, He usually makes 2 trips annually to the Holy Land: May and November….check him out on youtube, he has numerous talks… here’s one: His witness testimony

Plain Jane

Thank you G Catholic. Gonna do that now while I wash the chandelier.

Plain Jane

Just listened and chandelier now sparkles. I realized that I heard his talk before, but needed to hear it again, especially his exhortation at the end,to evangelize. Thank you bunches.

grandmaintexas

Me too!!

NYGuy54

You probably don’t know this but people who call themselves Jewish Catholics are implicitly insulting the religion. Zero chance a true Jewish person would enter the Catholic Church. If he practices in a church, he is no longer a Jew. He can allege he is but objectively he has abandoned the religion.
I know you meant that in a kind way.

grandmaintexas

I know how some understand it. I believe some converts call themselves Hebrew Catholics.
It is a delicate thing, and I meant no disrespect to the Jews.

Dora

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Sylvia Avery

Happy Hanukkah to all who celebrate it. Lovely thread, Wolfie. ❤❤❤

geneticallycatholic

Hi PJ, He usually makes 2 trips annually to the Holy Land: May and November….check him out on youtube, he has numerous talks… here’s one: His witness testimony

NYGuy54

Not a good Jew at all. Absolutely tragic.

geneticallycatholic

Apologies for the double post on Roy Schoeman…at least I think I posted twice erroneously.
The following should be on the open thread for today…but can’t find it…
a great interview with Sebastian Gorka…enlightening for sure by American Thought Leaders

GA/FL

“And GOD said, “Let there be light!”
Love, Truth, Joy, Life – are all equated with light…in Scripture, prose, poetry and song.
Whereas, Dark Ages refers to the conquest and oppression of the pagans putting out the light of learning, freedom, truth. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbarian_kingdoms
There is danger though – remember – Enlightenment and freedom, blessing and prosperity may cause leaders and scholars to think their achievements surpasses GOD’s Word/Will and negates or exempts them the Commandments.

NYGuy54

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NYGuy54

Some of you try to make Judaism a subset of Christianity. Not only is that false but it is a major insult to people like me who grew up in an orthodox synagogue. Try to just simply reflect on the holiday, extend your well wishes and move on. Any other way is a total lack of respect

Valerie Curren

I think it might be more accurate to say that Christianity is a sort of subset of Judaism. In the New Testament there was a controversy in the early church that in order to be a Christian one had to become a Jew first. This is discussed in the Book of Acts, in particular chapter 15, which can be found here:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+15&version=NIV
Jesus & all of his disciples were Jews & Paul (formerly Saul) had been a Pharisee that “studied at the feet of Gamaliel” before encountering the Lord on the road to Damascus.
Many Christians believe that this passage in Isaiah is a prophecy foretelling Jesus’ suffering & death:
Isaiah 53 New International Version (NIV)
53 Who has believed our message
and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.
4 Surely he took up our pain
and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression[a] and judgment he was taken away.
Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
for the transgression of my people he was punished.[b]
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
and though the Lord makes[c] his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
he will see the light of life[d] and be satisfied[e];
by his knowledge[f] my righteous servant will justify many,
and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,[g]
and he will divide the spoils with the strong,[h]
because he poured out his life unto death,
and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
and made intercession for the transgressors.
Footnotes:
a Isaiah 53:8 Or From arrest
b Isaiah 53:8 Or generation considered / that he was cut off from the land of the living, / that he was punished for the transgression of my people?
c Isaiah 53:10 Hebrew though you make
d Isaiah 53:11 Dead Sea Scrolls (see also Septuagint); Masoretic Text does not have the light of life.
e Isaiah 53:11 Or (with Masoretic Text) 11 He will see the fruit of his suffering / and will be satisfied
f Isaiah 53:11 Or by knowledge of him
g Isaiah 53:12 Or many
h Isaiah 53:12 Or numerous
New International Version (NIV)
Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.
copied the above from this site: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Isaiah+53&version=NIV
The entire book of Hebrews in the New Testament goes into detailed explanations of the deep truths revealed in the rituals of Judaism that are fulfilled through Jesus’ sacrifice.
Having attended a Passover Seder conducted by “Messianic Jewish Rabbi’s” I would wish to have studied Hebrew in Hebrew school to even get a glimpse of the depth & richness of the Jewish faith (which I believe is fulfilled, but not erased nor contradicted, through Christ). What if Jesus actually Is the promised Jewish Messiah???
Here is a blog post that goes into detail about the book of Hebrews (you can read that entire book throughout the post, though I copied those chapters from biblegateway.com like above) & faith:
https://specialconnections.wordpress.com/2018/09/02/abel-true-father-of-faith/
Anyway, no offence is meant by any of this. I share these things out of love & truly believe that we love & serve the same God, YHWH…I’ve written on this topic as well here:
https://specialconnections.wordpress.com/2016/10/12/christianity-judaism-one-in-the-olive-tree/
May God Bless You Richly in this New Year!

NYGuy54

The 2 religions are not connected. I view “messianic jews” with total contempt. It is an insult to say that the richness of Judaism is fulfilled through Christ. Absolute and total insult. Christ has no role in the religion. They are different and separate. Always and forever.

Valerie Curren

Well, no offence was meant. But I was (at least in part) referring to Mosaic law & sacrifice. God shed the blood of animals to “cover” the “sin” of Adam & Eve after “the Fall of Man”. Jesus was described as “the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world” in that His Blood would once and for all time redeem us from the curse of the law of sin & death, not just cover sin, like in animal sacrifice…
Here is a passage from Luke chapter 4 where Jesus illuminated some things (from biblegateway.com)
Luke 4: 14-30
Jesus Rejected at Nazareth
14 Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside. 15 He was teaching in their synagogues, and everyone praised him.
16 He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom. He stood up to read, 17 and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written:
18 “The Spirit of the Lord is on me,
because he has anointed me
to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners
and recovery of sight for the blind,
to set the oppressed free,
19 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.”[f]
20 Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him. 21 He began by saying to them, “Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”
22 All spoke well of him and were amazed at the gracious words that came from his lips. “Isn’t this Joseph’s son?” they asked.
23 Jesus said to them, “Surely you will quote this proverb to me: ‘Physician, heal yourself!’ And you will tell me, ‘Do here in your hometown what we have heard that you did in Capernaum.’”
24 “Truly I tell you,” he continued, “no prophet is accepted in his hometown. 25 I assure you that there were many widows in Israel in Elijah’s time, when the sky was shut for three and a half years and there was a severe famine throughout the land. 26 Yet Elijah was not sent to any of them, but to a widow in Zarephath in the region of Sidon. 27 And there were many in Israel with leprosy[g] in the time of Elisha the prophet, yet not one of them was cleansed—only Naaman the Syrian.”
28 All the people in the synagogue were furious when they heard this. 29 They got up, drove him out of the town, and took him to the brow of the hill on which the town was built, in order to throw him off the cliff. 30 But he walked right through the crowd and went on his way.
Footnotes:
f Luke 4:19 Isaiah 61:1,2 (see Septuagint); Isaiah 58:6
g Luke 4:27 The Greek word traditionally translated leprosy was used for various diseases affecting the skin.
New International Version (NIV)
Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.
I have zero background in Orthodox Judaism just various Christian practices, so we’ll have to agree to disagree as to the connection of Judaism & Christianity. Though I believe “Judeo-Christian” is in common usage & refers to underpinning commonalities of these faiths that inform Western cultures (among other things).
Best Regards!

Valerie Curren

A different perspective on “Messianic Judaism” is copied from a post of mine:
“As such, to briefly state my current perspective on this topic, I think the very best version of a faith heritage would (likely) be someone who was raised in the traditional Jewish faith and later on came to the “completed” knowledge of Jesus as their personal Lord. Savior, AND Messiah! I guess even better would be to be raised in a Messianic Jewish household replete with the beauty of the Historical Traditions of Judaism and the fullness of the knowledge of the completeness of the work of the Cross by our King of Kings and Lord of Lords. It is truly an extreme historical irony that the early leaders of “The Way”–which later became known as Christianity–argued amongst themselves as to whether or not one had to first become a Jew before becoming a Christian…as in being a Christian (in their minds) actually required someone to be a Jew first. Now the opposite distortion seems to be in play, in order to accept that Jesus is the (Jewish) Messiah you cannot be a Jew, for such a belief negates your very Jewishness–Wow!”
https://specialconnections.wordpress.com/2016/10/12/christianity-judaism-one-in-the-olive-tree/
I have been given to understand that there have been a number of prominent Jewish leaders that have come to the knowledge that Jesus Is the promised Messiah…though some have been unwilling to share this perspective overtly during their earthly life. One storied rabbi made his declaration in his earthly effects left for his son to wrestle with following his passing. I would guess that the “contempt” you express is one of the reasons that some faith leaders have had such a difficult time making public declarations that would likely lead to extreme rejection of their faith peers.
http://www.yeshuahamashiach.org/Kaduri_names_Messiah.htm
I share this info for your consideration with no disrespect meant. God Bless You Sir!

NYGuy54

I do not like it one bit so I prefer not to comment further. I will say their unstated goal is to destroy the religion using high minded phraseology.

Valerie Curren

Thanks for your insights.

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